The Great Wind and Wuthering mystery!

[jebho62]

Originally Posted by Visionsofangels

what you say!!..Not sure if your post was referring to me M? but just to set the record straight, I wasn't at any of those shows (unfortunately) like i said in my last post i was only about 10yr's old at the time!!!
What i was saying is, If i could go back in time, I'd have loved to have seen those shows, as for the Mama Tour..like you i have only ever seen it on video/DVD

harold the barrel...

[jebho62]

Originally Posted by Danlaw83

*sigh*, thank god it wasn't done in Semiphore!!!


get it???

Originally Posted by martinus

err... no i don't.

Originally Posted by Visionsofangels

Hmm, no me neither ...anyway Dano thought you were in OC? hope your having a good time!

I don't get it either D-dawg! Please explain! I am glad it wasn't written in Aramaic. We would have had to have had Martinus translate it for us if it had having been had

[martinus]

if I'd had had a hat, a hig hat or a hi-hat, i'd've had that. I don't, so I'll have supper instead.

[JerseyJoker]

Originally Posted by martinus

if I'd had had a hat, a hig hat or a hi-hat, i'd've had that. I don't, so I'll have supper instead.

Martin,

Is this a quote from Peter Gabriel, introducing Supper's Ready at a performance?

That's hysterical silly, I love it!

PS: Welcome to the group, Foxtrotter!

[martinus]

Originally Posted by JerseyJoker

Is this a quote from Peter Gabriel, introducing Supper's Ready at a performance?

Glad you enjoy it. It is not the Gabe. As Shakespeare would have said: "If this be mod-ness, yet there's method to it."

[foxtrotter]

Hiya again, one and all!! It is nice having the Genesis memories but of course the flipside is getting old!!

But in answer to the query about the best show, they were all really good but I guess the Duke tour was the best for me simply because we could only get 'hearing only' tickets and, as such, convinced ourselves for at least two months that we had to wait in the foyer and just listen to the gig. Imagine the feeling we had when this bloke said to us: "Oy, aren't you two going in?"

Also, Genesis back then in the late seventies were absolutely HUGE! Probably the biggest band in the world (and they weren't driven out of town by the Pistols/Clash etc despite what any punk will tell you). So I expected Phil to be REALLY SERIOUS as befits any housekeeper of such a mega-band, and instead he was having a go at the roadies and their smoke machine and telling 'Albert' stories and generally clowning around and I'm sure you know he is very funny and relaxed on stage - especially when spontaneous (if you ever see Tony Banks relaxed send me a postcard!). So all in all it has to be the Duke gigs.

Anyway, I love sharing these memories but it feels a bit like boasting so I'm going to rein in here. Here's something else!

Can ANYBODY fathom out what the bloody hell (story) is going on in 'One For The Vine'? There are so many things going on, but there seems to be a mediterranean ecosystem in a polar wasteland, and what's with the mysterious tribe of people on the glacier; also who is the figure the hero sees who 'flees back up the mountainside'? Is there a timeslip, is he seeing himself.

I hope it's not like the great 'Lurker' "riddle", where everyone tore their hair out for ten years trying to work out what it was, and then they just said: "Oh, we just stuck that in for a laugh".

Hmmm. It is indeed a jigsaw, it is purple haze... IT's over to you...

[martinus]

Originally Posted by foxtrotter

Hiya again, one and all!! It is nice having the Genesis memories but of course the flipside is getting old!!


Can ANYBODY fathom out what the bloody hell (story) is going on in 'One For The Vine'? There are so many things going on, but there seems to be a mediterranean ecosystem in a polar wasteland, and what's with the mysterious tribe of people on the glacier; also who is the figure the hero sees who 'flees back up the mountainside'? Is there a timeslip, is he seeing himself.

I think he does see himself. Or he sees someone acting the same way he did before and so he realizes what has happened to him and them and that history repeats itself.

One For The Vine may be loosely based on H.G.Wells' story of The Country Of The Blind. This is from the beginning:

Long years ago that valley lay so far open to the world that men might come at last through frightful gorges and over an icy pass into its equable meadows; and thither indeed men came, a family or so of Peruvian half-breeds fleeing from the lust and tyranny of an evil Spanish ruler.

[Visionsofangels]

Originally Posted by foxtrotter

Can ANYBODY fathom out what the bloody hell (story) is going on in 'One For The Vine'? There are so many things going on, but there seems to be a mediterranean ecosystem in a polar wasteland, and what's with the mysterious tribe of people on the glacier; also who is the figure the hero sees who 'flees back up the mountainside'? Is there a timeslip, is he seeing himself.

I hope it's not like the great 'Lurker' "riddle", where everyone tore their hair out for ten years trying to work out what it was, and then they just said: "Oh, we just stuck that in for a laugh".

Hmmm. It is indeed a jigsaw, it is purple haze... IT's over to you...

It seems your not the only one wondering what the song 'One For The Vine' is all about!
I have just come across these reviews, a lot of them do seem to think a spiritual & religious theme is happening here..I personally think it's going to be something we'll never truly know, not unless Genesis themselves spill the beans and give reasons behind the song, this is just typical of Genesis..they put lyrics out there that nearly always have us scratching our heads! (the same with Floyd) and usually what happens is..for example, how i personally perceive one song, somebody else may well view it completely differently!
Nevertheless it's a classic song, lyrically & musically and I'm sure everyone will agree with that!

Anyway speaking of mysterious as such, let me ask a question.....Now we all know that Peter is quite spiritual & mystical, could even go as far to say, he's pretty much out there, which is no bad thing, it's what makes him who he is & why he's got so many fans, But does anyone know why he came up with the name Rael for TLLDOB?
I came across this site (not intentionally, i hasten to add) and I'm just wondering who got the idea for the name first? http://www.rael.org/rael_content/intro.php as you can see this guy who's real name is Claude Vorilhon (i wonder what or who made him change his name to Rael?) also has a lot to do with spiritualism & the ''other side''!, also if you listen to this guy, it seems he started this movement back in '73, The Lamb was released in '74..coincidence? who knows!
I know i could be totally off the page here thinking there may be a link between the two, but i'm just being curious that's all !!

Oh & for the record, I know this has nothing to do with the story of the Lamb, my question is about Why & What made Peter choose that name!

Review about One For The Vine

My thoughts | Reviewer: Morgan | 6/13/09

This song may purport to be about Jesus, but it's not really about the Jesus of the Bible. The real Jesus was victorious. The main character in this song seems too uncertain and defeated to be the chosen one portrayed in the Bible.



Followers of the New Messiah | Reviewer: Greg Z | 2/25/09

A mini-rock opera masterpiece of both music and lyrics. The words resonate now, with the way people follow the new messiah, whether he's right or wrong, and the way certain people keep seeking messiahs instead of following their own judgment.



HELICOIDAL LEVELS | Reviewer: Miguel Maldonado | 8/26/08

The whole song is obviously all about Jesus, his way of spreading his teachings, his point of view about his own fate, a reminding of his own moment of weakness, awareness of what people expected from him (be honest, that influences almost everyone's decisions). But the loops are what I'm intrigued about, I have imagined that Jesus was a follower of other even greater than he was, 'till something made him quit and flee back up the muntain side, he probably realised that his leader's teachings were all just common sense matter; thus reaching the same wisdom, and making him able to appear to and lead others at a lower existence level (as probably his former leader did), suggesting this all could be a succesion of existence leves, both upwards and downwards to infinty.



The last matey was nearly right. | Reviewer: JimB | 5/27/08

I think that the man before said that the story is all a loop, that is pretty obvious.
However our theory is that after some refreshing water he moves onto the Vine, which is a metaphor for Wine and gets totally and utterly pissed.
All then becomes clear and he just can't be arsed to lead anyone in a hangover and just disapears and so the loop continues.



One Loop for the Vine | Reviewer: RegularJoe | 1/29/08

Aside from the religious allegory in the song (whether Jesus, Mohamed, or any other deity you want to throw in), I see a loop in the story.
The unnamed one who's 'faith had died, Fled back up the mountainside' slips, falls, and vanishes (to external observers).
Next he's made the leader of the locals where he ends up because of his magical appearance (what else can this wizard do? he'll help us beat the bad guys, whomever they are.) although he never voices a claim to be a chosen one. Then some contemplative time, followed by leading his new followers on to battle.
Finally he sees a familiar shape flee up a mountain (as he did), trip and fall (as he did), and vanish (as he did).
I think he sees himself, in a loop. I mean, the final stanza all but spells it out:
Then, on a distant slope, (the slope he fled up)
He observed one without hope (himself, as described early in the song)
Flee back up the mountainside. (as he did)
He thought he recognised him by his walk, (think you could pick yourself out of a crowd? I know I could)
And by the way he fell, (sound familiar?)
And by the way he
Stood up, and vanished into air. (back to the beginning).
The whole story loops on itself. Fairly obvious. No particular religion required.
There's my 3 cents.



In Reference to One for the Vine | Reviewer: A. Neely | 12/17/07



This is clearly a song about the difficulty of inspired leadership -- especially if the leader thinks he is divinely inspired. While the story seems completely fictitious, it draws from a number of biblical themes -- deliberately, in my opinion.

A rebel is disenchanted with a religious/military leader who calls himself "the chosen one." The rebel breaks away from the 50,000 strong who follow him. But the rebel unwittingly falls into the same trap, and finds himself leading a group on a similar religious journey. In an effort to break free from the cycle of deceit, the rebel meditates alone and finds himself talking with "water" and "the vine."

He then rises up, apparently with new inspiration and direction, and leads the group to a plain he sees ahead. He surely hopes to find a successful resolution for himself and for the group there, probably through the establishment of a new, peaceful community.

But he is startled by the sight of another adventurer alone on a mountainside like he was. This individual also stumbles, as he did; but then he stands up, and -- the narrator tells us -- "vanished into air."

I have no doubt this final figure symbolizes Jesus, the ultimate Rebel Messiah. According to the Bible, on several occasions Jesus was in a physical location, then vanished from sight in an instant (eg. Luke 24, Acts 1).

In addition, the water and vine metaphors bring to mind statements attributed to Jesus in the gospels. Jesus said, "I am the vine; you are the branches. He who abides in me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without me, you can do nothing." (John 15:5) Jesus also said: "If anyone thirsts, let him come to me and drink." (John 7:37) The verses that follow this passage clearly indicate that he was speaking of spiritual satisfaction, but they also point to Jesus as the source of "living water."

Who knows whether songwriter Tony Banks had these specific scriptures in mind when he wrote the song? But I am convinced the title is a reference to Jesus “The Vine,” and I believe Banks was familiar with the biblical concepts I've mentioned, and at least toyed with them in his song

If there is a theme to One for the Vine, which tracks the mountain journeys of three unique individuals, the thought that Jesus is the only (God-) man capable of leading people on a successful spiritual quest is one that works.



one for the vine truth | Reviewer: robert simpson | 11/30/07

this song is clearly about the walk of jesus,"he shall save us..." thank you genesis for a song about our king



Thoughts on One For The Vine lyrics | Reviewer: C Gibson | 10/4/07

I don't know if the lyrics refer to any specific person or situation in history. This has been one of my favorite songs lyrically and musically since I was a mid-teen, and I have pondered its meaning constantly.

I believe that it is about the essential rebellious nature of youth, the sincere desire to strike out on a different path than what is expected (familial, societal), and discover and develop one's own voice - often impulsively. Many elements of adult society seem drab, hyprocritical, and outright dangerous to a teen. The more spirited among us often declare that we will "do things differently." Yet, the path to maturity has its inevitable direction, we encounter circumstances beyond our evident control, and sure enough one day we look up and find that we are as those same adults we swore we'd never become. Think of the boy who pursues an artistic vocation only to end up taking over his father's business or the woman who discovers that as an adult she frequently feels like a carbon copy of her mother. The moment we make these discoveries about ourselves is generally the moment it appears that our youthful selves have truly, alas, "vanished into air." Our priorities and sense of identity have matured, and the motivations of adults that we could never fully have understood as kids are now all too evident and all too relevant.

Anyway, those are just my thoughts on the lyrics. I always find listening to this song to be an incredibly moving experience.



"One For the Vine": Sources? | Reviewer: Judas's Carry Out | 7/23/07

Besides being a beautiful swan song for Genesis' symphonic prog era, this epic from "Wind and Wuthering" is some type of exegesis regarding war and religion. Does anybody know the specific literary/historic source for the lyric? Example: "Eleventh Earl of Mar" which proceeds it, is about a little known Scottish rebellion in 1715.





Review the song One For The Vine

[martinus]

I am surprised at how many people think One For The Vine has something to do with J.C. The lad from OftV may or may not know what he is doing, but it occurs to me that Jesus knew very well what he did and what would happen. He also did not flee. (except for half an hour in Scorcese films ).

It seems to hold some kind of message for movements with one "big leader" at the top...

[foxtrotter]

Good call Martinus and Visionsofangels!! I can add the symbolism of the mountainside (an important religious motif for Moses and Abraham). Plus the water, and then with the vine. Water into wine??

Hmm... COME ON TONY! LOG ON AND SPILL THE BEANS!!

Rael's name origins. I haven't a firm clue, but I suppose if Demons (pronounced Dee-mons) is also historically spelt 'Daemons', then it could follow that Rael (pronounced: 'Rayl') COULD also be spelt 'Rael' but pronounced 'Real'. A pun on someone backward of reality? Have we all been pronouncing it wrong all along? Does P G ever say the word: 'Rael' as well as: 'our hero'? But I could be wrong on that. Is this just the sort of word-play Peter Gabriel would fool us with.

Affter that last paragraph I now have a headache and I am going to lie down.