For some reason Phil's health really hits me hard...

  • I only recently became a full-fledged Genesis fan (jn the last 2-3 years). I was a fan of their later works (Invisible Touch was first album/concert and I discovered the other 80's albums and some of the solo works). But it wasn't until a few years ago that I started from 1968 and started listening to EVERYTHING (and watching any video I could find). The band immediately vaulted into my top 5 of all time (along side Yes, Rush, Toto and <not sure>). When you are discovering a band decades after their heyday, it's a weird experience. Because you also want to try and connect with the band and its fans today. And that's when it hit me how much Phil has been suffering health-wise. For some reason, seeing him in his heyday (otherworldly drummer, dynamic performer) side by side with him sitting in a chair singing is really hard for me to take. And I don't understand why. I try to be grateful that he is alive and performing, with his son on drums, no less. What a great thing. But it's still hard for me to take. For some reason it bothers me worse than the fact that we lost Chris Squire, and Rush is retired. Anyone else feel that way? Sorry to bring the thread down.

  • Certainly for long-time fans, seeing our childhood icons age reminds us of our own mortality and theirs.


    But in terms of the feelings of a newer fan I think I may be able to relate in the sense that about 2½ years ago I had a resurging interest in David Bowie.

    I always had a few of his albums in my collection but then I heard some post ‘90s music of his one day which I really liked, and that spurred me to explore some of his later stuff, and also revisit some of the albums I had previously skipped over.

    I was really starting to get into him, buying his albums, filling in some gaps in my collection and listening to him a lot.

    And then it seemed just eight months after this sudden interest in Bowie, he died, and I was like, “Oh no. Really? I can't believe this.”

    In the last three years, there have been a number of musicians I like who have died but I think Bowie’s was the one that hurt the most because of the preoccupation I had with him at that time.

  • Certainly for long-time fans, seeing our childhood icons age reminds us of our own mortality and theirs.


    In the last three years, there have been a number of musicians I like who have died but I think Bowie’s was the one that hurt the most because of the preoccupation I had with him at that time.

    My thoughts and experiences exactly. Plus the fact, that an old friend of mine, who was a huge fan of Bowie, died in March last year.

    First we learned to walk on water.

    Then we tried something harder.

    - Red Seven -

  • Phil's long-ongoing health battles really bother me as well. I think they bother me so much because Phil just seems like a regular nice guy, like someone you would know at work or as a neighbor. Also, it doesn't seem like he lived the kind of lifestyle that would have warranted having his health fail him so drastically (e.g., Keith Richards and Ozzy Osbourne (among many others) should have died several times over from all of their excesses over their careers, and yet they are relatively unscathed). Phil's difficulties just seem a bit unfair, esp. since some of them seem to have arisen from his just doing his job (e.g., his neck problems arose simply from the posture he used while playing the drums).


    Yes, his current condition bothers me as well.

  • Very sad to see a favourite icon suffering this way. On a positive note at least he's alive and performing. I agree on the above post, when you see celebrities poisoning their bodies, it makes Phil's case very unfair IMHO. :(

  • Just a few days ago I watched the 1990 Serious Hits Live DVD for the first time since maybe eight years. Well, I was completely blown away by the power of the performance! Phil and all his band members seemed almost hyperactive to me! That was really nice to see. I also noticed Phil smiling every now and then in a way that made me think he was actually feeling good and enjoying himself. As we all know this hasn't always been the case for him.


    Regarding his current tour I agree it's sad to see him performing sitting. But, I think the appearance could be much better. If he's supposed to be performing sitting, they should not use any bloody cheap office chair they happen to find, they should design a chair specifically for Phil's needs. The chair should be higher, and it should be more mobile. Also, the chair must be designed to give him a better posture, which will enable him to look more active and perhaps also bring more power to the singing. The key term is ergonomics!


    I've been a fan of Genesis (and solo careers) since 1991. I was 16 then and now I'm 43. I realize that I'm now older than they were when they released We Can't Dance. That's a very simple and undisputable fact, but it doesn't make it any easier for me to grasp or accept emotionally. And the same goes of course for the 1990 Phil solo show I watched the other day: last time I watched it they were older than me. Anyway, I still like all the music as much as I did when I first discovered it. All this lovely music will stay with me for the rest of my life, and since I'm 25 years younger than them I understand that they will not be with me forever. When it comes to Phil's current tour, I think the feeling is there and that's what's important, even though the actual performance may not be as perfect and dynamic as on previous tours. I'm just glad he's well enough to actually do this tour. I have watched some clips on Youtube and noticed a great improvement in the performance, which I think is promising.

  • It's a difficult question & I empathasise. I have not really discussed it on this board, but I was a devoted Eagles & Glenn Frey fan. When Glenn Frey died, 8 days after Bowie (and I was still reeling from Bowie's death), it was devastating. I had seen him live so often & it was only the last tour I saw in 2015 when it was obvious that he was no longer himself. Still, when he died it was a bolt from the blue. Even worse, the 'Eagles' decided after a year had passed to continue without him.

    So I am grateful that Phil is still with us, I admire his fortitude & his courage, & I hope I get the chance to see him live. I am also a fairly recent Genesis addict.

  • It's a difficult question & I empathasise. I have not really discussed it on this board, but I was a devoted Eagles & Glenn Frey fan. When Glenn Frey died, 8 days after Bowie (and I was still reeling from Bowie's death), it was devastating. I had seen him live so often & it was only the last tour I saw in 2015 when it was obvious that he was no longer himself. Still, when he died it was a bolt from the blue. Even worse, the 'Eagles' decided after a year had passed to continue without him.

    So I am grateful that Phil is still with us, I admire his fortitude & his courage, & I hope I get the chance to see him live. I am also a fairly recent Genesis addict.

    Oh my...I still remember how dreadful 2016 was for older (and seemingly not-so-old) musicians: David Bowie, Glenn Frey, Keith Emerson, Prince, Greg Lake (among many others). The year before claimed Chris Squire and the year following John Wetton - I remember yelling to the heavens, "Please stop it!"


    I saw the Eagles in the UK in 2014 and it was fantastic - but, I agree: Glenn clearly wasn't himself. It was almost like they were touring because they sensed that it might be Glenn's last go-round. In any case, I'm glad I got to see them with Glenn still with us (and I'm much less interested in seeing them without Glenn).


    I'm torn about seeing Phil on this tour. I'd like to see him because I do think this is his last tour (despite Tony's semi-recent comments about his being at least willing to entertain the possibility of reuniting - if this info is unfamiliar to anyone, I can try to find the link - let me know on-thread); on the other hand, I'm not completely convinced I can handle seeing him struggling in any way in performance. That would affect me negatively. In any case, I'm glad he's giving it a go though.

  • No need to apologise, I feel it too (and I am also a younger fan). Like others have said it feels a bit unfair or out of proportion compared to some people who have seemingly taken a lot worse care of themselves. While Phil has had a great time of it with success, he's also been the target of a lot of unnecessary meanness over the years, meanness that he does seem to take to heart and that he's never deserved. At any rate, I hope he's enjoying this tour and getting better all the time.

  • Some interesting comments in the above posts. First, I do agree with the OP and no need for an apology. PC has always been a favourite musician of mine and having seen him in action a few times in person as well as the countless times on screen, yes its hard to now see him as a sort of diminished figure. For me, the main sadness is his not being able to drum any more.


    Plus, in all honesty, another purely selfish reason I feel sad about it is that his physical inability to drum means whatever dwindling possibility there'd been of more Genesis shows has vanished completely.


    Re Bowie, his death remains the one I can't believe actually happened. Well, obviously I know it did, but you know what I mean! But yes with Squire and Wetton etc going, horrible as it is we are now into that phase where these musicians we admire are reaching the end of their lives and we know there'll be other sad news to have to endure. But the fact their work endures is a comfort.

  • Some interesting comments in the above posts. First, I do agree with the OP and no need for an apology. PC has always been a favourite musician of mine and having seen him in action a few times in person as well as the countless times on screen, yes its hard to now see him as a sort of diminished figure. For me, the main sadness is his not being able to drum any more.


    Plus, in all honesty, another purely selfish reason I feel sad about it is that his physical inability to drum means whatever dwindling possibility there'd been of more Genesis shows has vanished completely.


    Re Bowie, his death remains the one I can't believe actually happened. Well, obviously I know it did, but you know what I mean! But yes with Squire and Wetton etc going, horrible as it is we are now into that phase where these musicians we admire are reaching the end of their lives and we know there'll be other sad news to have to endure. But the fact their work endures is a comfort.

    The part I highlighted of yours reminded me about the story I alluded to in my last post.



    Here is it and, IMHO, take it with a very large grain of salt - on the other hand, the source is Tony Banks himself:


    http://ultimateclassicrock.com…-collins-genesis-reunion/



    Again, I am very highly dubious about this ever occurring, but at least 2/3 of the trio are somewhat willing to let the mere idea still exist...

  • his physical inability to drum means whatever dwindling possibility there'd been of more Genesis shows has vanished completely.

    If it's a reunion of the three man era band there's no problem: his role is primarily as a singer and he doesn't have to drum. Of course I would like him to drum, but it would actually work without him drumming.

  • When he first returned to the stage, I was concerned. His voice wasn't right, he looked uncomfortable and slow getting to and from the stage, and when he had his fall I feared the worst. Well, not the absolute worst, but I thought it might end it before it really got going.


    Since then, his voice has noticeably improved and the few videos I've seen on YouTube from his recent shows he's looked to me like he's moving quite a bit more freely. I don't expect to ever see him behind the kit again, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's performing on his feet again before too long (unless I've missed something).


    I've seen some comments (I think it was on some Facebook groups) that his management should be stopping him from performing, but from what little I know of Phil, I'm pretty sure if he wants to do something (or doesn't), it's his call. There's no chance in hell of anyone booking those US gigs against his wishes. And, unless I'm looking through rose-tinted glasses, if he is improving then long may he continue.

  • Thanks for the above OFTV, come to think of it I'm sure I read those comments but possibly in a different interview with TB in which he qualified it with something like "You have to ask though, with a different drummer, will it really be Genesis?"

    If it's a reunion of the three man era band there's no problem: his role is primarily as a singer and he doesn't have to drum. Of course I would like him to drum, but it would actually work without him drumming.

    True, in theory that could work. I never stop hoping! I suppose it's any 5-man show that would be the main issue.

  • a different interview with TB in which he qualified it with something like "You have to ask though, with a different drummer, will it really be Genesis?"

    Chester would be the natural choice as drummer, just as in 2007. Does this mean that for some reason Chester is no longer an option as drummer for Genesis? There have been rumours about a fall out between Phil and Chester, but I have never heard anything substantial about it. Maybe Tony's comment is the first public indication that Chester is out of the picture?

  • Chester would be the natural choice as drummer, just as in 2007. Does this mean that for some reason Chester is no longer an option as drummer for Genesis? There have been rumours about a fall out between Phil and Chester, but I have never heard anything substantial about it. Maybe Tony's comment is the first public indication that Chester is out of the picture?

    Like you, I've heard there is some kind of schism but haven't seen or heard anything specific. I'm just left with a sort of general impression that CT is as you say out of the picture.


    I do get what TB means, but then, new personnel were added for the CAS album and tour, which didn't seem to have made TB worried whether it's still Genesis or presumably he wouldn't have wanted to be involved.

  • I know it's been years now and I should be used to it, besides he had sort of drifted apart from the drums becoming more and more a singer and songwriter but it always saddens me when Phil says in an interview that he can't play drums anymore. Apart from the fact that he was truly brilliant, he was always very proud of his skills as a player. He loved drumming, he loved that role and you could tell that he took pride in his playing. I don't know.....It's just sad.

  • I know it's been years now and I should be used to it, besides he had sort of drifted apart from the drums becoming more and more a singer and songwriter but it always saddens me when Phil says in an interview that he can't play drums anymore. Apart from the fact that he was truly brilliant, he was always very proud of his skills as a player. He loved drumming, he loved that role and you could tell that he took pride in his playing. I don't know.....It's just sad.

    Yes - I think that's the bit specifically that really gets to me: Phil Collins - Phil Collins - can't play the drums anymore?!?! That just shouldn't be allowed... ?(

  • It is incredibly hard to see him struggling on the stage but imagine how hard it must be for him. He has been a performer for most of his life and it must be terribly difficult for him not to able to do what he loves the way he used to do it.

    Hats off to him for still performing live on stage - he could just gracefully leave the limelight but is still keeping his fans happy. I would definitely still go and see him.

  • I know it's been years now and I should be used to it, besides he had sort of drifted apart from the drums becoming more and more a singer and songwriter

    Not really. At the height of his success (around the time of But Seriously), he was still doing session solely as a drummer for the likes of Tears For Fears, Bruce Hornsby, Eric Clapton and Stephen Bishop, not to mention the various charity gigs (Nelson Mandella's 70th Birthday concert. the Princes Trust etc) where he lent his percussive skills to the many bands who performed.


    It's a complete misnomer that Phil somehow abandoned the drums or "drifted away" from his first love once he became a singer songwriter.