Genesis, Genesis Album

  • In this alternate universe, the title of Phil’s subsequent solo album, No Jacket Required, would have attracted some more attention…

    Stepping out the back way, hoping nobody sees...

  • Anyway...

    The theme of this thread is a discussion on the title but I guess title and cover do go hand in hand and we have gotten into retrospective musing on the cover of this album as well.

    In some ways it could be argued that it couldnt have been that bad , as it sold millions and paved the way for the mega success they had with IT , so they did alright with it.

    However most seem to think it was pretty poor including the band. The title and the cover seemed like they couldn't think of anything else . We know now why they titled it that way but I didn't know at the time and it would have been nice to have understood that then. TBH it's only fans like us that make a point of finding out about these things that do know, so putting something on the album to emphasise that point would not IMO have been a bad thing. Personally I've always enjoyed sleeve notes or the odd line somewhere on the sleeve or inner about the album . Also I don't think a picture of the band would necessarily been bad depending on how it was done of course. All dressed up as Mexicans !! (That was a joke)

  • Were there any proper B sides for this album, and if not, was it the only Genesis album without any?


    Feel like I should know this but I don't.

    The only studio leftover was “A Call To Arms”, which Mike subsequently used on the first Mike & the Mechanics album. Details here (look in the “Background and recording” section) :


    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik…he_Mechanics_(1985_album)


    There were no studio b-sides; however, there was a lovely live version of “Firth Of Fifth” on the 12” single for “That’s All”.

    Stepping out the back way, hoping nobody sees...

  • There were no studio b-sides; however, there was a lovely live version of “Firth Of Fifth” on the 12” single for “That’s All”.

    If it was from the 81 tour, which I think I recall reading it was, then yes it would be superb - their rendition of it on the Abacab tour, the last time they'd play it in full I believe, was the best it ever sounded live. Ditto Supper's Ready on the 82 tour. At that point they were absolutely incendiary on stage and it particularly elevated the 70s stuff.

    Abandon all reason

  • The only studio leftover was “A Call To Arms”, which Mike subsequently used on the first Mike & the Mechanics album. Details here (look in the “Background and recording” section) :


    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik…he_Mechanics_(1985_album)


    There were no studio b-sides; however, there was a lovely live version of “Firth Of Fifth” on the 12” single for “That’s All”.

    Thanks. I remember liking that song although I haven't heard it in 20 years. Didn't know it was a Genesis leftover.


    I know they were all busy with solo projects but it seems a little odd to have exactly the amount of songs needed for the album recorded. I always imagined they'd have a couple extra then leave out the weakest couple and figure out sequencing the remainder. I'm trying to imagine if they finished recording the last track for Genesis and knew "there, it's done".

  • I'm trying to imagine if they finished recording the last track for Genesis and knew "there, it's done".

    Most bands probably have that sort of feeling when recording. Whether it's when they've gone beyond the amount of material suitable for a single album, or have reached pretty much that point, they'll have a shared sense of when to stop.


    Also bear in mind that (as I understand it) this was the first time they arrived empty-handed, intending to create an entire album in the studio without anyone bringing in pre-written stuff. Hence, of course, the self-title - sort of a new beginning. With that sort of 'rebirth' I imagine a band could go either of two routes: experience an explosion of fruitful spontaneity and end up with truckloads of stuff, or have a period of intense activity that's very focused and produces limited but usable material. I can also surmise that in that latter situation, they might think "quit while we're ahead" - don't just plough on and end up over-cooking stuff.

    Abandon all reason

  • Were there any proper B sides for this album, and if not, was it the only Genesis album without any?

    Well, GENESIS was the only Genesis studio album of the post-Gabriel years not to have any associated non-album B-sides. There weren't all that many non-album tracks released in the Gabriel era, of which some were A-sides rather than B-sides, and not all the albums had any associated with them.

    The only studio leftover was “A Call To Arms”, which Mike subsequently used on the first Mike & the Mechanics album. Details here (look in the “Background and recording” section) :

    It's a stretch calling ACTA a "studio leftover" since it was just a "bit" that Mike and his co-writers built a song around, rather than an actual leftover song, as some seem to think is was. (I've read a professional review of the first M+M album where the writer assumed that Tony Banks wrote the lyrics to ACTA.)

    "Just because you're smart doesn't mean you're not stupid."

    -- attributed to a former Mensa president


    You can go the popular way or the right way, but usually not both.

  • In the Genesis Forum Italia, I found this post from 2009, by a good Genesis expert:


    "They entered (Genesis) in the studio without an idea, without traces without enthusiasm but full of arrogance: We are the Genesis, something will come out.

    The few ideas materialize in no more than three pieces; the rest is a bunch of sessions thrown away in some way where more was lost time than anything else".


    True or false? :/

  • Sounds like a misinterpretation of a bad translation. Otherwise it's bollocks.

    Abandon all reason

  • It's a stretch calling ACTA a "studio leftover" since it was just a "bit" that Mike and his co-writers built a song around, rather than an actual leftover song, as some seem to think is was. (I've read a professional review of the first M+M album where the writer assumed that Tony Banks wrote the lyrics to ACTA.)

    Well, you incorrectly “stretched” what I meant by “studio leftover”. ^^ What you spelled out is what I meant by a studio leftover, i.e., a musical idea that was tried out, but ultimately was not completed. If some kind of rough version had ever been anywhere close to completion, I’m sure that some vestige of it would have found its way to the trading community over the many intervening years.


    Yes, the lyrics are interesting to ponder. They do sound a bit Tony-ish, but it wouldn’t be a stretch to think that Mike (with or without further assistance) could have written them too. If they are Tony’s, it would explain why Mike asked Tony and Phil for permission to use the song on the first M&tM album. The original idea for the song was Mike’s in the first place, but if Tony wrote some/most/all of the eventual lyrics, then permission would certainly be needed. (Of course, this begs the question what Phil would have conceivably done with the early development of the idea to require permission being asked, unless that was just a courtesy since they were returning to an “all titles done by all” position.)

    Stepping out the back way, hoping nobody sees...

  • I've just given it a spin. It was Par Avion I was thinking of, I quite like that tune.


    A call to arms... It might be another 20 years before dust it off. Starts strongly with a mildly threatening verse and good bass line, then dissolves in formless MOR for the chorus.

  • I've just given it a spin. It was Par Avion I was thinking of, I quite like that tune.


    A call to arms... It might be another 20 years before dust it off. Starts strongly with a mildly threatening verse and good bass line, then dissolves in formless MOR for the chorus.

    That's very like the trajectory of Nobody's Perfect. Excellent fragmented intro and first verse with really nice minor-sounding build and a sort of ominous, slightly tense feel - then bursts into a bright sunny playschool swingy-armed chorus, and all the air goes out of the song.

    Abandon all reason