GENESIS - Live At Wembley Stadium (DVD) - a reassessment 2023

    • Official Post

    In light of the upcoming release of the BBC Broadcasts 5CD / 3LP sets by Genesis, Tom Morgenstern has done a re-evaluation of the DVD Live At Wembley Stadium.

    The reason doing this was mainly the question which recordings of which days ended up on the DVD release and whether there are overlaps with the BBC Broadcast from 4 July 1987 (last show).


    You can find the article here:


    https://www.genesis-news.com/c…VD-reassessment-s871.html


  • Christian,


    That is so cool that Tom prepared this and a coincidence as I started yesterday comparing the bootlegs to the dvd to see which performances were from which night as well. This was really hard because the band and Phil's consistency in performance is really unbelievable. His vocal lines over those four shows were each very close. I made it through Mama which I identified as July 3 and Abacab which also came from the 3rd. I got stuck on the Abacab from the Invisible Touch Live single when I realized that the first set or vocal lines or half of the song didn't come from any of the four shows but the second half sounds like it came from July 2nd. I was going to continue today, and your post already did all of that for me:). Thanks so much to you and Tom. I was going to do the same for the Earl's court shows on the 1992 dvd but that may take longer since there were six nights. Maybe that is something Tom will prepare in the future.


    Is Tom Morgenstern the same as TM Productions?

    • Official Post

    Woah, I never knew Mama and That's All on The Way We Walk were from 1987.

    they were never played in 1992, same with In Too Deep.

  • they were never played in 1992, same with In Too Deep.

    Yes, if I had ever given it more than a passing thought I would have realized. I think from time to time it did ripple across my awareness that there was something just not right, particularly with Mama not being on the DVD I guess.

    • Official Post

    I understand Mama was played at the first few 1992 shows.

    ooops - of course, sorry. Nevertheless Mama was among the track on TWWW not recorded during the 1992 tour.

  • Is bootleg with 3 July- with 3 July is Mama, Abacab, Invisible Touch, Turn It On Again, Land Of Confusion ( on 80% is Drum Duet, Los Endos and Tonight, Tonight, Tonight) With 2 July is Domino, That's All, Throwing It All Away ( probably Home By The Sea).

  • (Just to complete the excellent review of Tom Morgenstern)

    Conclusion: an absolutely professional video production that one could well imagine on Blu-ray, provided of course that the HDVS original in 2003 had also been digitised with at least 2K resolution (had they?).

    The HDVS capture may have been transferred to film at the time :

    Peter Wilson (from High Definition & Digital Cinema), who worked on the HDVS production of this concert, said that the tapes have been transferred to 35mm film using Sony EBR process (and then blown up to 70mm film). source: hddc.co.uk


    ps : Electron Beam Recording (EBR) was a process developed by Sony PCL to transfer HDVS video tapes (1125i @ 60hz) to 35mm film @ 30fps. (There also was a mode to transfer into 2250p @ 24fps to simplify the direct distribution to cinemas!)

    Edited once, last by jpp ().

  • (Just to complete the excellent review of Tom Morgenstern)

    The HDVS capture may have been transferred to film at the time :

    Peter Wilson (from High Definition & Digital Cinema), who worked on the HDVS production of this concert, said that the tapes have been transferred to 35mm film using Sony EBR process (and then blown up to 70mm film). source: hddc.co.uk


    ps : Electron Beam Recording (EBR) was a process developed by Sony PCL to transfer HDVS video tapes (1125i @ 60hz) to 35mm film @ 30fps. (There also was a mode to transfer into 2250p @ 24fps to simplify the direct distribution to cinemas!)

    Correction to link: Welcome to HDDC Ltd.

    Ian


    Putting the old-fashioned Staffordshire plate in the dishwasher!

  • I should imagine there's a fair few fans who would like this on blu ray (although I question the likely quality) but I doubt this would come out before When in Rome, and we've only been waiting 15 years for this. Patience, you cry!


    Meanwhile PF are celebrating Dark Side's 50th with a £250 megaset.

  • Meanwhile PF are celebrating Dark Side's 50th with a £250 megaset.

    Gross.


    Edit: I've just checked and that box set contains the exact same album 12 times - yes twelve, and two copies of a live version. So 14 copies of DSOTM in various mixes, surround sound, cd, vinyl etc.


    So it's even grosser than I initially thought.

  • (Just to complete the excellent review of Tom Morgenstern)

    The HDVS capture may have been transferred to film at the time :

    Peter Wilson (from High Definition & Digital Cinema), who worked on the HDVS production of this concert, said that the tapes have been transferred to 35mm film using Sony EBR process (and then blown up to 70mm film). source: hddc.co.uk


    ps : Electron Beam Recording (EBR) was a process developed by Sony PCL to transfer HDVS video tapes (1125i @ 60hz) to 35mm film @ 30fps. (There also was a mode to transfer into 2250p @ 24fps to simplify the direct distribution to cinemas!)

    Do you think that there is film of three of the shows in Genesis or Jim Yukich's possession? Could these theoretically be re-edited and prepared for HD blu-ray? I wonder how well a 4k scan of the 35mm film/HDVS tapes would look. I imagine it could be stunning. I also wonder if in fact there aren't some camera shots of the In The Cage Medley from one or more of the nights since there were 8 camera men I believe. I'm sure Genesis still recorded the audio via digital multi-track of the four shows and wouldn't stop the audio recording to change tape during the medley. It would be really cool boxset if the band was into releasing material like so many of their contemporaries.

  • Could these theoretically be re-edited and prepared for HD blu-ray?

    There are two options :


    1. if the HDVS tapes have been transferred to film at the time (as mentioned by Peter Wilson), and if this transfer resurface one day, it will have to be scanned.

    2. if the HDVS source tapes still exists, so they will have to be transferred.


    Perhaps my memory is playing tricks on me, but I remember (in 2002?), that someone from the Genesis production team had confirmed that the group may had in its archives the original tapes, but they did not consider a transfer because it was too complex or too expensive.

    I also remember (or believe) that someone had located a company (in Germany ?) still having the necessary competence, but nothing occurred...


    Now, if the HDVS tapes still exists, I think the best solution would be to get in touch with a die hard enthusiast, like https://www.youtube.com/@hdvs (in Italy), who collects such HD analog equipments. (He have some Sony VTR like the HDV-1000.)


    I wonder how well a 4k scan of the 35mm film/HDVS tapes would look. I imagine it could be stunning.

    By way of comparison, a such "HDVS tapes backup project" has already been undertaken by the EPFL (for the Montreux Jazz Festival) :


    https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/d…ux-jazz-heritage/28996072 :

    In early 2000 Nobs enquired about Sony’s HD Montreux Jazz archive and was told the firm was about to erase them as they were too expensive to keep. He eventually paid SFr10,000 and brought them all back to his private bunker via the Swiss diplomatic courier service.”


    I invite you to see the result by watching the Toto Rosanna HD transfert !


    ps : for the most curious of us, some information from a 1991 audio revue here (in PDF).




  • Thanks for these insights, very enjoyable read!

    I did not know that they didn't take recordings from the final Wembley show for the VHS/DVD!

    some are wise ... and some otherwise

  • Is Tom Morgenstern the same as TM Productions?

    In a way, yes. The latter has since become the name of my audio restoration and mastering company, but I left out the space.

    Some interesting stuff there except for the formulaic moaning about a band having the temerity to mainly do stuff from their latest, massively successful album.

    If you read my review carefully, you will have noticed that I found it far more deplorable that they wasted time with nonsense like the "domino principle" and the "audience participation time" and a far too long encore-medley of unrelated music instead of playing more good music from their back catalogue. Then even a full-length "Invisible Touch" album would also have been more bearable.