Your Own Special Way

    Quote from Fabrizio

    That and the fact there are no incidents reported or documented to dispute their own claims. If you have other elements or infos, by all means...

    What claims? They haven't made any. You're presuming that most artists aren't thin-skinned individuals who dislike criticism based on the little you know about a few members of Genesis.


    Whereas I, who have worked in the business since the mid-nineties, have given you an informed opinion that being sensitive to criticism is endemic in the arts. That's not enough for you? Fine, continue to presume the contrary if it suits you.

    Quote from StillCan'tDance

    What claims? They haven't made any. You're presuming that most artists aren't thin-skinned individuals who dislike criticism based on the little you know about a few members of Genesis.


    Whereas I, who have worked in the business since the mid-nineties, have given you an informed opinion that being sensitive to criticism is endemic in the arts. That's not enough for you? Fine, continue to presume the contrary if it suits you.

    Easy. We are not arguing here, merely debating and I have no interest in prevailing and nothing ''suits' me here. I have no agenda and no dog in this fight. Tony and Mike said they stopped reading the reviews and caring about their content long ago. That's a claim. Made several times. Again, it may not be true but there is no evidence to the contrary. Peter, while pondering on Ant's departure decades later has clearly said you have to be ready to face and not care about people who hate you. That's another claim. Their behavior have been consistent with those claims. There are no reports indicating otherwise. I don't think I am the one presuming here. I am certain there are many artists who feel awful about things said about them and their artistic output. Some, I am sure, cope with it better than others, Phil doesn't seem to cope with it particularly well. There is evidence for that, isn't there?

    Quote from Fabrizio

    Phil doesn't seem to cope with it particularly well. There is evidence for that, isn't there?

    Oh god, yes, tons! He also happens to be considerably more successful than his peers in Genesis. I'm sure - as I said before when I mentioned Frank Sinatra - that the response to negative criticism in artists who are mind-boggingly successful is not just a coincidence.

    Quote from StillCan'tDance

    Oh god, yes, tons! He also happens to be considerably more successful than his peers in Genesis. I'm sure - as I said before when I mentioned Frank Sinatra - that the response to negative criticism in artists who are mind-boggingly successful is not just a coincidence.

    By that criteria people like McCartney or the Stones, Sting or U2 should be murdering journalists. I will not dispute Phil was more successful than his peers in Genesis, although Peter didn't do too bad either but granted, he was treated far better. I don't really think the amount of success is tantamount to thinner skin. If anything it should make you immune and give a 'whogivesashit' attitude. Sinatra was a Capo, a hot-tempered Sicilian with mob mentality. He didn't complain or felt bad, he downright threatened and sometimes even punched critics.

    Sinatra was a what? A "capo"? What on earth...? He was a bona fide manic depressive and yet you claim he never "felt bad".


    Anyway, you're wrong in thinking that being more successful makes you care less about what people think about you. Dead wrong, mate.

    Quote from StillCan'tDance

    Sinatra was a what? A "capo"? What on earth...? He was a bona fide manic depressive and yet you claim he never "felt bad".


    Anyway, you're wrong in thinking that being more successful makes you care less about what people think about you. Dead wrong, mate.

    A mobster. You need to brush up on you Godfather ;) I might be wrong sure but remember, I am not making broad sweeping statements here and I am not generalizing. I am just saying each is different and copes with it differently, the level of success notwithstanding.

    I know we are way off topic, but it is important to distinguish association with causality, particularly directionality. I don't know, but it may be true that more successful entertainers are more sensitive to criticism. What is harder to determine is what causes what. Are those who are more sensitive also more talented and destined for greater fame? Or is it that those who become more famous are subject to greater scrutiny/criticism and become more sensitive?

    Quote from Dr. John

    Are those who are more sensitive also more talented and destined for greater fame? Or is it that those who become more famous are subject to greater scrutiny/criticism and become more sensitive?

    I think it would be extremely difficult to establish any sort of correlation and I also don't think one can claim absolute expertise. Look at athletes, some, no matter how skilled, collapse under pressure some thrive and rise to the challenge. Ultimately, I believe, it doesn't have to do with what you do but what you are made of. We are all different, we all cope with things differently and artists are no exception.