Forum user interaction: DO NOT get personal

  • I always thought this is would not be necessary.


    We are here because we like the music of Genesis and its solo outlets

    We are here to discuss highs and lows of their outputs

    We are here to learn from each other other's point of views.


    That could be so simple, but


    We are NOT here to insult others, be personal against others, get off topic in threads etc.

    Please always stick to the subject!


    If you really think you need to discuss something with other users on a personal level, use the "conversations" option but still be polite and behave and treat others as you like to be treated yourself.

    If you really think it is necessary to insult others, destroy any conversation / discussion, then this is the wrong place for you and we ask you to leave.


    If someone still continues to destroy threads by posting stuff which clearly do not have anything to do with the subject and are an insult to others, we will ban you permanently!



    IMPORTANT: If you feel insulted or think someone's behavior is not in line with our forum rules, please report the post and do not start discussions about that in the thread.


    Thank you

  • I hope you have sent private messages to the individual(s) concerned, as I doubt he'll take much notice otherwise.


    As a mod on the old forum for several years, I can tell you from experience:


    Leopards don't change their spots, if they behave this way, they will tend to do so permanently. They will also tend to be more confrontational online than in person, that's just how it is. It seems one person is the focus of all the confrontation on here, that says it all, and if you don't deal with it, it is unreasonable to expect everyone to turn the other cheek. Why should they?


    Krissy appointed me as I was willing to try diplomacy, but once it was clear it isn't working, it was time to stand up to the offender. Those are my spots.


    Incidentally, you say (don't) "get off topic in threads etc. Please always stick to the subject!" - this may seem a good thing, but it can make for a very dry, bland, and boring forum. Sometimes (And we often did it on the old forum, so you are expecting old members to change the habit of a forum lifetime) a logical progression onto other matters in some way related, but not on-topic, would lead to a thoroughly satisfactory and rewarding exchange of views or facts. I think the "on-topic only " attitude may be "correct" but it's not always helpful, in the long run.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • Christian,

    I would like to urge you to consider a 'zero tolerance' approach to personal insults / attacks. They often start mild but often quickly escalate. If people can't make their points without insulting others on a personal basis, then they should be banned. This is not a children's playground. One of my threads has now been ruined by trolling and I'm considering deleting all my posts on this thread and effectively shutting it down in response. Nobody wants to read threads full of abusive posts. The forum will ultimately suffer if this continues.

    Thank you for giving this due consideration.

    ~ My talents may not be obvious but they are always...always...delicious! ~

  • Incidentally, you say (don't) "get off topic in threads etc. Please always stick to the subject!" - this may seem a good thing, but it can make for a very dry, bland, and boring forum. Sometimes (And we often did it on the old forum, so you are expecting old members to change the habit of a forum lifetime) a logical progression onto other matters in some way related, but not on-topic, would lead to a thoroughly satisfactory and rewarding exchange of views or facts. I think the "on-topic only " attitude may be "correct" but it's not always helpful, in the long run.

    I agree with that.

    First we learned to walk on water.

    Then we tried something harder.

    - Red Seven -

  • Incidentally, you say (don't) "get off topic in threads etc. Please always stick to the subject!" - this may seem a good thing, but it can make for a very dry, bland, and boring forum. Sometimes (And we often did it on the old forum, so you are expecting old members to change the habit of a forum lifetime) a logical progression onto other matters in some way related, but not on-topic, would lead to a thoroughly satisfactory and rewarding exchange of views or facts. I think the "on-topic only " attitude may be "correct" but it's not always helpful, in the long run.

    Hi Ian,


    The problem is not to discuss any subject from various points. Getting off topic means getting rude or writing something that has nothing to do with the subject at hand. We won't check all threads and punish people just for joking around etc, we just want to make sure that a thread about the quality of Who Dunnit doesn't ed up in a major Brexit discussion. Or, and that's my point, in a "chat" between two or three members, using rude language etc.


    Despite that, appointing further "staff" is on my list.


    I have my experience in our German forum as well and I can agree to what you have written. Since this forum is quite young (as people interested needed to reregister), we have decided to see how things evolve. In this context, speaking about trolls, rude language etc, I simply ask you NOT to react directly in the thread but to report the post in question.


    Replying to an offensive post doesn't really help, as my experience shows.


    In any case. What we all want is a friendly atmosphere. And I can assure you we will take the appropriate actions to make that happen.

  • Reporting might work, although personally I found the old Forum to be a bit too lenient in this regards. Personally I prefer to reason privately but as Ian said, some people really don't change and feel emboldened by the anonymity of the web. A bit radical perhaps, but against those keyboard-lions I found the wonderful feature of blocking the member in question this forum provides to be a good deterrent. Your and his comments are not visible, unless somebody quotes them to reply, so trouble is avoided. It's a bit of a defeat, I would admit that, after all we are here to debate but when someone cannot do it civilly or has an agenda, why going through the aggravation? I used it with someone who has been pestering me for over a decade through various, past incarnations of the forum and it worked. Blocked him as soon as he signed in. Of course, he tried to pester on by copying a quoted comments but I cannot see or reply so it's all good. In the end though, let's tray to reason shall we? Getting personal over stuff here is really not worth it.

  • schrottrocker, you've got a "conversation" (a.k.a. PN) ... So, soon, someone who is wondering "Who? Is it me?" will soon still be wondering, but unseen by you :-)

    ...cried a voice in the crowd.


  • How can I block a member? I didn't figure out yet how to do that :|


    while we are at it. I recently saw, that we have a hidden member. I didn’t know, that you can hide your presence on here.

    First we learned to walk on water.

    Then we tried something harder.

    - Red Seven -

    Edited once, last by slowdancer ().

  • Unmittelbar auf dem Profil des Mitglieds in Frage, rechts oben, ''User'' anklicken und da sind verchiedene Optionen moegligh, darunter auch diejenige, die wir besprochen habe ;-)

    Danke! :)



    For the record, nobody is "it" yet. I just wanted to know - I see I didn't even figure out 10% of all the functions of this forum :/

  • Reporting might work, although personally I found the old Forum to be a bit too lenient in this regards. Personally I prefer to reason privately but as Ian said, some people really don't change and feel emboldened by the anonymity of the web. A bit radical perhaps, but against those keyboard-lions I found the wonderful feature of blocking the member in question this forum provides to be a good deterrent. Your and his comments are not visible, unless somebody quotes them to reply, so trouble is avoided. It's a bit of a defeat, I would admit that, after all we are here to debate but when someone cannot do it civilly or has an agenda, why going through the aggravation? I used it with someone who has been pestering me for over a decade through various, past incarnations of the forum and it worked. Blocked him as soon as he signed in. Of course, he tried to pester on by copying a quoted comments but I cannot see or reply so it's all good. In the end though, let's tray to reason shall we? Getting personal over stuff here is really not worth it.

    Interesting that you think the old forum was too lenient, for, although there were times when this was true, generally, the moderating was swift and effective. Latterly, it could have been an issue as all the mods simply drifted off the facebook, (Except Choccy, who took the time and trouble to PM me and explain her (very valid) reasons for absence) but during my solo tenure, people seemed to behave, and my only issues were policing new applications, to weed out the spammers.


    Here, however, the whole mood seems different. Where is all the old humour? Gone, along with most of the members. We seem to have a lot of new ones who are a bit too "earnest" and lacking in social graces. One member in particular, a regular offender, has got away with, among other things, a veiled but all too clear threat of violence, and, in a post I've reported, but on last checking, still present, a denigrating remark about a non forum member, but member of the public. The new rules don't cover this, it seems, but on the old forum, we didn't allow such things, as the forum is publicly viewable, and we did have, on at least one occasion, feedback from the management of one Genesis member who wasn't happy about a post. Doesn't have to be a Genesis member in my view, if someone makes a derogatory remark about a non member, the forum has a responsibility to act. So far, I haven't even had acknowledgement about my report, let alone action or an explanation of inaction.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • Interesting that you think the old forum was too lenient, for, although there were times when this was true, generally, the moderating was swift and effective. Latterly, it could have been an issue as all the mods simply drifted off the facebook, (Except Choccy, who took the time and trouble to PM me and explain her (very valid) reasons for absence) but during my solo tenure, people seemed to behave, and my only issues were policing new applications, to weed out the spammers.


    Here, however, the whole mood seems different. Where is all the old humour? Gone, along with most of the members. We seem to have a lot of new ones who are a bit too "earnest" and lacking in social graces. One member in particular, a regular offender, has got away with, among other things, a veiled but all too clear threat of violence, and, in a post I've reported, but on last checking, still present, a denigrating remark about a non forum member, but member of the public. The new rules don't cover this, it seems, but on the old forum, we didn't allow such things, as the forum is publicly viewable, and we did have, on at least one occasion, feedback from the management of one Genesis member who wasn't happy about a post. Doesn't have to be a Genesis member in my view, if someone makes a derogatory remark about a non member, the forum has a responsibility to act. So far, I haven't even had acknowledgement about my report, let alone action or an explanation of inaction.

    I do think the the old Forum was a bit lenient at least for my taste, personally I believe if you harass or insult somebody you have no business being on a Forum and that happened. The abovementioned pesterer got away with it over and over, for years and throughout various incarnations of the forum, I might add.

    I would never complain about moderators being too absent, they volunteer the service and it is not something I pay for, bearing in mind that I don't want to moderate myself, I don't feel I have the right to complain. However, when formal complaints are filed AND backed up, actions need to be taken imo. I understand what you say, when you talk about some members being too ''earnest'' and lacking social graces but those are in my mind two different things. I wouldn't blame anybody for the former, I have no tolerance for the latter. I particularly despise those so-called keyboard-lions, hiding behind the net, distance and relative anonymity. People who I bet would never dare take a certain tone in a conversation face to face but feel free and safe to unleash on the internet just because they can get away with it. So far I haven't reported anyone. I blocked one and I am so very happy the option is given, I tried to reason with two but that for me is a yellow card and I agree, people rarely change so I believe, it's possible the red card will soon follow.

    Ultimately, I think a Genesis Forum, in particular, lends itself to conflicts as there are quite divided camps. Generally and I want to stress this, I am generalizing, Phil's fans are quite aggressive and feel compelled to defend their idol when they feel he is being treated unfairly which in their mind seems to be always. I remember an argument and I am being serious with a member of the previous Forum that couldn't stomach the Lamb but would listen to it just for the backing vocals. That was funny. Peter's era fans are, again generally speaking a bit more relaxed and perhaps snobbish but in the end I will never understand why getting angry and personal over who was the best or stuff like that.

  • I once was asked by Krissy to do the job of a moderator, but I rejected. Ever since, I kept wondering, what I would have done in certain situations in case I was a moderator. And I must confess, that I found it highly difficult. The more I admire foxfeeder for his busy and reliable work as as a moderator on the old forum. I agree, that this forum is different from the old one and that we have some people around here, who - I would say - are testing borders and sometimes seem to take things a bit too serious. On the other hand, I have seen trolls on other forums, we never saw the likes of these on here or on the old forum.

    First we learned to walk on water.

    Then we tried something harder.

    - Red Seven -

  • I agree that the forum is split into various camps.. Both early and latter Genesis members here. Suppose a lot depends on the decade you were born and when you first listened to Genesis or members of Genesis solo works?.....


    Personally I don't get into heavy debates. I generally post mainly of my love in progressive music or similar works that I enjoy. :)


    I also enjoy the other topic sections, which can be quite amusing and sometimes informative. ;)


    The great thing I like about this forum is the notification warnings above, which forces me to look and view other peoples replies ^^... Though sometimes I ignored on the old forum. :P.. I also praise the like symbol here... :thumbup:


    I'm sure Christian and Krissy will have a difficult time selecting new mods here, but hope they're representive to the subject matter in hand... ;).... I believe Krissy used this on the old forum and it worked. :)

  • Personally I don't get into heavy debates. I generally post mainly of my love in progressive music or similar works that I enjoy. :)

    This is pretty much in line with what I have observed on various forums throughout the years and I do hope nobody gets ticked off by what I say, it's not an exact science, just a broad-sweeping remark based on observation but I do feel sometimes that Phil's era fans have inherited Phil's sensitivity and perhaps are just tired of all the flak he had to endure which let's admit it was a bit too much, whereas Peter's era fans seem to know what they like and like what they know and are pretty much unfazed by derogatory comments, although again, there is an undercurrent aura of haughtiness sometimes in this camp. I got hooked up on Genesis with Supper's Ready, some came on board through the Tarzan's soundtrack and guess what, it doesn't make more ''MY'' band than his. Nobody owns the Genesis and it is not Peter's or Phil's band or Steve's. That's right Ian :-) It's a band with a decades long career and a bunch of very talented individuals with very different skillsets. Pointless to argue over this imo.

    Edited once, last by Fabrizio ().

  • I once was asked by Krissy to do the job of a moderator, but I rejected. Ever since, I kept wondering, what I would have done in certain situations in case I was a moderator. And I must confess, that I found it highly difficult. The more I admire foxfeeder for his busy and reliable work as as a moderator on the old forum. I agree, that this forum is different from the old one and that we have some people around here, who - I would say - are testing borders and sometimes seem to take things a bit too serious. On the other hand, I have seen trolls on other forums, we never saw the likes of these on here or on the old forum.

    See? This is why among reason I don't want to moderate. I wouldn't find it difficult at all. First infraction I warn you, second you are out but this is very dangerous thinking and it cannot work like this, you have to be willing to invest time and above al patience and I am not.

  • This is pretty much in line with what I have observed on various forums throughout the years and I do hope nobody gets ticked off by what I say, it's not an exact science, just a broad-sweeping remark based on observation but I do feel sometimes that Phil's era fans have inherited Phil's sensitivity and perhaps are just tired of all the flak he had to endure which let's admit it was a bit too much, whereas Peter's era fans seem to know what they like and like what they know and are pretty much unfazed by derogatory comments, although again, there is an undercurrent aura of haughtiness sometimes in this camp. I got hooked up on Genesis with Supper's Ready, some came on board through the Tarzan's soundtrack and guess what, it doesn't make more ''MY'' band than his. Nobody owns the Genesis and it is not Peter's or Phil's band or Steve's. That's right Ian :-) It's a band with a decades long career and a bunch of very talented individuals with very different skillsets. Pointless to argue over this imo.

    Oh, it's certainly not Steve's band, I agree. But he was an important and integral part of it, which some seem to want to deny.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life