Genesis in the media

  • Another one of those absurdly expensive Genesis magazine specials is out, this time from Classic Rock. The usual collection of old articles and interviews complete with poor proofing, terrible overbaked writing and standard factual errors. Plus in this case, the "40 Greatest Genesis Songs" as nominated by the readers of Prog Magazine, leading to some ridiculous choices such as RA&B but which will please many here.


    And how do I know all this? Because, sucker that I am, I obviously bought the damn thing. More money than sense, me.

    Abandon all reason

  • Another one of those absurdly expensive Genesis magazine specials is out, this time from Classic Rock. The usual collection of old articles and interviews complete with poor proofing, terrible overbaked writing and standard factual errors. Plus in this case, the "40 Greatest Genesis Songs" as nominated by the readers of Prog Magazine, leading to some ridiculous choices such as RA&B but which will please many here.


    And how do I know all this? Because, sucker that I am, I obviously bought the damn thing. More money than sense, me.

    Are you talking about Classic Rock magazine or Prog magazine. ? If the readers have chosen RA&B , then they know their stuff.

  • Are you talking about Classic Rock magazine or Prog magazine. ? If the readers have chosen RA&B , then they know their stuff.

    The special has the Classic Rock logo on the front, but features stuff from both mags. I gather the "40 best" list is from Prog readers. It puts Robbery at 33, ahead of Duchess and Fading Lights among others. Duchess is about 100 zillion times better than Robbery, at a conservative estimate. So no, they don't "know their stuff". Or at least, they do know some stuff but it's stuff that's stupid and wrong.

    Abandon all reason

  • The special has the Classic Rock logo on the front, but features stuff from both mags. I gather the "40 best" list is from Prog readers. It puts Robbery at 33, ahead of Duchess and Fading Lights among others. Duchess is about 100 zillion times better than Robbery, at a conservative estimate. So no, they don't "know their stuff". Or at least, they do know some stuff but it's stuff that's stupid and wrong.

    Robbery, Assault and Battery is probably my least favorite song on ATOTT. But, I certainly like it much more than I like either Duchess or Fading Lights. To me, those two songs are the most overrated in Genesis' entire catalog. I know a lot of people love those songs, but neither one does anything for me.

  • Tony Banks once said, that Duchess was one of the band`s greatest tracks. I tend to agree.


    Welcome to this forum, Mr Hamilton-Smythe. I am reminded of James Bond alias Mr. St.John-Smythe.


    :)

    First we learned to walk on water.

    Then we tried something harder.

    - Red Seven -

  • The special has the Classic Rock logo on the front, but features stuff from both mags. I gather the "40 best" list is from Prog readers. It puts Robbery at 33, ahead of Duchess and Fading Lights among others. Duchess is about 100 zillion times better than Robbery, at a conservative estimate. So no, they don't "know their stuff". Or at least, they do know some stuff but it's stuff that's stupid and wrong.

    RAAB is a great song. Prog readers do know their stuff. Duchess and FL are clearly great too . In way it's wrong to judge one song against another when it gets gets that standard but also great fun . However RAAB IS better than both of those songs . I scientifically and objectively prooved that RAAB is better than both those songs a long time ago by listening to them in a scientific and objective way. And that's not at all stupid or wrong. So you you need to like it more or you will find yourself all wrong and confused. 😃😃😃

  • RAAB is a great song. Prog readers do know their stuff. Duchess and FL are clearly great too . In way it's wrong to judge one song against another when it gets gets that standard but also great fun . However RAAB IS better than both of those songs . I scientifically and objectively prooved that RAAB is better than both those songs a long time ago by listening to them in a scientific and objective way. And that's not at all stupid or wrong. So you you need to like it more or you will find yourself all wrong and confused. 😃😃😃

    Nah. It's crap. And shouldn't be in a top 40, let alone ranked better than those 2 songs. But I'd happily allow it in a Worst Genesis Tracks chart, no problem.

    Abandon all reason

  • I like RAAB from a technical standpoint. Lots of fun keyboard bits and the middle section is great fun in 13/8. This song live with Bill Bruford is always a pleasure to listen to, as is the original.


    That said, I like both Duchess and FL more. I can say I get more of a "feeling" from them. The instrumental sections of each are so different but I feel an emotional connection to them. The lyrics mean more to me certainly, especially on FL.


    But it's hard to compare such completely different songs. If we are talking purely classic prog sounds here then I get RAAB being higher than these two. It has the big instrumentals, synth solo, mellotron, interesting time signatures, and it tells a story. These aren't all things necessary for a good song but they help in a classic prog poll I would imagine.

  • I like RAAB from a technical standpoint. Lots of fun keyboard bits and the middle section is great fun in 13/8. This song live with Bill Bruford is always a pleasure to listen to, as is the original.


    That said, I like both Duchess and FL more. I can say I get more of a "feeling" from them. The instrumental sections of each are so different but I feel an emotional connection to them. The lyrics mean more to me certainly, especially on FL.


    But it's hard to compare such completely different songs. If we are talking purely classic prog sounds here then I get RAAB being higher than these two. It has the big instrumentals, synth solo, mellotron, interesting time signatures, and it tells a story. These aren't all things necessary for a good song but they help in a classic prog poll I would imagine.

    Joking aside (not that I was joking that much!) it is indeed a bit meaningless to rank tracks from across such a rich and varied career. And of course it's pretty unsurprising that readers of a magazine called PROG are going to rate Robbery higher than the likes of trio stuff such as Duchess.

    Abandon all reason

  • I just love the instrumental bit in RAAB. I think it's tremendous. Duchess and FL are also tremendous.

    I agree, the instrumental section is fantastic. I don't like the lyrics very much - they're just a bit of fun, but they don't have the same surreal vibe as Gabriel's lyrics. They struggled with that side of things for a while, and they got better when they did songs like Duchess - instrumentally and melodically still outstanding, but with thoughtful, clever lyrics. I do wonder if you could, in this case, say that objectively Duchess is the better song. No-one is (surely) going to claim that the lyrics to RAAB are amazing, but you could certainly claim that the lyrics to Duchess are very good indeed.

  • I agree, the instrumental section is fantastic. I don't like the lyrics very much - they're just a bit of fun, but they don't have the same surreal vibe as Gabriel's lyrics. They struggled with that side of things for a while, and they got better when they did songs like Duchess - instrumentally and melodically still outstanding, but with thoughtful, clever lyrics. I do wonder if you could, in this case, say that objectively Duchess is the better song. No-one is (surely) going to claim that the lyrics to RAAB are amazing, but you could certainly claim that the lyrics to Duchess are very good indeed.

    As I said before Duchess is a great song. I find it difficult to judge songs objectively anyway. Obviously some songs are more complicated than others, making them cleverer . Duchess has a great feel and emotion to it which is it's strength but can't quantify that objectively. Trying to be objective I do wonder why so many people like so many dreadful tunes but generally there's no accounting for what moves us. One reason I like this site is that we all share and get our love of Genesis where the vast majority of the country would not have clue about their music.. The two songs are very different anyway . I prefer RAAB. Don't think there is anything wrong with the lyrics though earlier Genesis did have that surreal element you mention.I love the way it flows from jauntiness the grand music in the middle . It makes it all the better. OFTV does the same .

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  • Here's a clip about Phil from an eight year old guardian article. Its an article about rock and pop myths that are believed to be true . I came across it whilst looking for a pic (in games) and have put the link in the random section because there are several things in it and I didn't want to detract from the Genesis theme here . Anyway I had heard this and thought it true. Shame. I never paid much attention to it ,he never said much about politics and I know offhand comments are so blown out of proportion. He had a lot of stick for it. Not true at all then. Am not really that surprised.


  • I don't know much about UK politics but I remember hearing a rumour likely about what you are referring to. Figures it's false of course. I've heard other things attributed to Phil (one of which a friend of mine gave me gruff about for listening to him) which I've never seen the slightest evidence of. Gotta love them false rumours...