Are political threads allowed?

  • I told myself I wouldn't comment further on this thread. Damn it, I've gone against my own directive. Just one more time.


    With apologies, I'm not following the importance of voting these days, unless of course you are a dyed in the wool card carrying member of the usual AC/DC main parties. In the UK we will probably get something in the region of 60% voter turnout if the wind blows in the right direction. We have a population of circa 70m and I'm unsure of the voting population number but let's say it's 60m (I could be generous here). So, on a very rough and ready basis, about 36m will vote. Of that 36m roughly 42% will vote for the "winning" party, so we're down to around 15m. This means that about 21% of the UK population actually votes for the government. Let that sink in. This is not democracy; it's a travesty. And in the absence of credible alternatives it's absolutely disgusting.


    Consequently, for me and I'm sure many of the majority who won't vote for the next government, or see that there is no difference between the 'opposame' parties on anything that really matters, the only sensible thing to do is speak to the complete farce that this is and spoil my ballot (unless there is a credible independent - which looks unlikely in my constituency). These ballots are still counted by the way. I rather wish more would do the same (unless interested in the usual charade parties of course) as I have a strong feeling that the silent majority would then get noticed.


    I'm definitely out of this thread now! :)

  • A few things on the stats, because that's the kind of guy I am, and one further observation although Micklemus might not see this having exited!


    At the 2019 GE the registered electorate was 47m, and the 67% turnout = 31.5m. The Electoral Commission estimates around 8m eligible voters are not registered. I don't know how many disqualified adult voters there are, but as there are around 13m children and the eligible voting population is 55m it seems it must be around 2 million. That means 15m people effectively have to have decisions taken for them by 55m, but in 2019 it was 31.5m, or 57% of the eligible voting population.


    Re who we vote for and whether to spoil or abstain, there's another consideration which doesn't often get discussed but was touched on earlier here. We vote for our constituency MPs, and for some people the key thing is how good the sitting MP is. There are even supporters of an opposing party who nevertheless vote for their incumbent MP despite their being from a different party, because they recognise they are a good and effective local representative. There are genuinely good MPs you never hear about because they are committed to their constituency, aren't ministers and just get on with their job with no desire to seek higher office. Some will scoff at this idea, believing all MPs are conniving self-serving shysters but there are effective ones who simply do the job.

    Abandon all reason

  • A few things on the stats, because that's the kind of guy I am, and one further observation although Micklemus might not see this having exited!


    At the 2019 GE the registered electorate was 47m, and the 67% turnout = 31.5m. The Electoral Commission estimates around 8m eligible voters are not registered. I don't know how many disqualified adult voters there are, but as there are around 13m children and the eligible voting population is 55m it seems it must be around 2 million. That means 15m people effectively have to have decisions taken for them by 55m, but in 2019 it was 31.5m, or 57% of the eligible voting population.


    Re who we vote for and whether to spoil or abstain, there's another consideration which doesn't often get discussed but was touched on earlier here. We vote for our constituency MPs, and for some people the key thing is how good the sitting MP is. There are even supporters of an opposing party who nevertheless vote for their incumbent MP despite their being from a different party, because they recognise they are a good and effective local representative. There are genuinely good MPs you never hear about because they are committed to their constituency, aren't ministers and just get on with their job with no desire to seek higher office. Some will scoff at this idea, believing all MPs are conniving self-serving shysters but there are effective ones who simply do the job.

    I've seen it and I'm back again! I'm a danger to myself! ^^


    Good and sensible points as far as I am concerned - thank you for your input. I also think your stats reinforce my point.


    Sadly my constituency MP is one of the bottom feeders who need culling but unfortunately return every five years with the regularity and joy of a bad dose of clap. Apt also that I should refer to my MP returning "every five years" as she is startingly absent for the rest of her time.


    If it wasn't obvious already, I'm about as far removed from party politics as you can possibly imagine. It's a cesspit and a charade. For me, a vote cast in that direction is a vote to stay on the same path to oblivion, just looking left or right along the way (or perhaps varying degrees of left now) depending on which puppets are in government at any particular time. It astounds me that educated adults have not noticed that things are getting progressively worse across the board irrespective of which colour rosette is on the door. Einstein had a famous quote for those who keep doing the same thing and expecting different outcomes.


    "I'll vote for the other lot this time, it has to be better, and they say nice things about the NHS and stuff"

    "Really mate, does that stack up? What about after the last time you voted? Or the time before that?"

    "Oh stop being so negative. This is democracy"

    "Sheesh. OK stay on the hamster wheel, I'm sure you'll be much more fulfilled if you ride it in the opposite direction for 5 years"


    If I have a position, it's probably somewhere between anarchist and extreme libertarian. If however a good independent candidate becomes available (not the case at present in my constituency) then he or she will have my support. Failing that, I have my marker pen ready to express my disgust at this foul system!


    I promise to try watching only from here on (again)! ^^:thumbup:<3

  • Republicans push conspiracy theories after Hunter Biden verdict: ‘A fake trial’
    Rightwing politicians repeat unfounded theories that gun trial verdict is a ‘distraction’ from worse Biden crimes
    www.theguardian.com


    Hunter Biden guilty, and it still isn't good enough for Republicans.


    These are the same people who had no issue with the 'justice' system when the Trump stacked Supreme Court gutted Roe vs Wade.

  • Big win for labour.


    I see the Russian bot farms getting their way with "stories" of Biden's supposed senility making their way into mainstream news outlets. It doesn't auger well. The country (US) is fucked because of the supreme court anyway, but it could always get worse and I think it would if Trump gets in. That he is even close is a major symptom of the aforementioned fuckedness.

  • Big win for labour.


    I see the Russian bot farms getting their way with "stories" of Biden's supposed senility making their way into mainstream news outlets. It doesn't auger well. The country (US) is fucked because of the supreme court anyway, but it could always get worse and I think it would if Trump gets in. That he is even close is a major symptom of the aforementioned fuckedness.

    Added to which is the "fact" (if it is, but the BBC reporting it, so likely) that some Democrat sponsors are threatening to withdraw funds if Biden doesn't step aside, so "democracy" in the US, once again, is second fiddle to money!

    Ian


    Putting the old-fashioned Staffordshire plate in the dishwasher!

  • But back to the UK, all (well, mostly) good news, Labour win, but now with added fiscal responsibility, Truss loses her seat, George Galloway loses his seat, possibly doing a "Truss" by being an MP for the shortest term ever. (I don't know if that's true, but it must be close.) Also, the SNP get shown the door, hopefully they'll take the hint.

    Ian


    Putting the old-fashioned Staffordshire plate in the dishwasher!

  • But back to the UK, all (well, mostly) good news, Labour win, but now with added fiscal responsibility, Truss loses her seat, George Galloway loses his seat, possibly doing a "Truss" by being an MP for the shortest term ever. (I don't know if that's true, but it must be close.) Also, the SNP get shown the door, hopefully they'll take the hint.

    Paisley gone too which is best of all imo.

  • Just about woken back up after my election all-nighter.


    It's a huge relief to finally see an end to this succession of appalling tory governments. It's a stain on the UK's political culture and an embarrassment that lowlifes like Johnson, Dorries and Braverman, among others, could attain high office. Although Braverman and several other of the worst specimens unfortunately held their seats.


    But it was a joy to see that fossilised stick of edwardian halitosis Rees Mogg shovelled up and dumped, along with Andrea "The Finger" Jenkyns, primitive thug Jonathan Gullis and many others - including all of Grant Shapps's various multiple identities - and of course, as mentioned, Liz "Beaten By A Lettuce" Truss.


    What an ungracious horrible twerp 'Pork Markets' Truss is, refusing to make the usual concession speech and petulantly stomping off, thus shunning the tradition of thanking her campaigners, supporters and constituents. But there's the measure of her. She can now go back to the US to continue promoting her doolally book and batshit theories about how she was brought down by "the deep state" and that well-known cabal of far left activists, the, er... ahem... banking industry.


    All that said, I can't get over-excited about the Starmer Labour government. We can only hope there'll be positive changes. Re the SNP, like many I've become disenchanted with them but part of me was still sorry to see them fall. They now have to face whatever awaits them in the 2026 SP election. As with the tories, extended time in power brings issues that can torpedo a party. They have done good things and as a resident in Scotland I can attest that life has largely felt better compared to my time in England, and I hope that if they equally fail in 26 that the presumed subsequent Scottish Labour government doesn't start to undo the positives.

  • Some of us were never enchanted with the SNP in the first place, what with Salmond, "innocent until they failed to prove him guilty", who chose to work for Russia Today, (along with Galloway, a measure of them both), Sturgeon, whose involvement in the Salmond case was, at the very least, odd, has had her own chickens come home to roost, and the whole SNP fund issue is still to unfold, but a major political party with a campaign fund smaller than some peoples savings? Hmmmm!


    But my major issue with the SNP is simple, and long standing. I'm half-Scottish, my dad was a union supporter, (he was pro-Scottish, but never anti-English, if Scotland weren't in the World Cup, as was usually the case, he was behind England all the way, unlike some, who took the opposite approach, from either side of the border!) his sister was an independence advocate, and no issue came between them like this. One night they had an almighty row, which was awkward, as we were staying at her house! Luckily, my mum calmed it all down, but I was with my father. Scotland, and, to a lesser extent England, are far better off together than apart, fact the majority saw back at the referendum, and to throw 300+ years of history and togetherness away is, in my view, simply stupid.

    Ian


    Putting the old-fashioned Staffordshire plate in the dishwasher!

  • to throw 300+ years of history and togetherness away is, in my view, simply stupid.

    I wouldn't so easily dismiss like that the range of deep-rooted views of pro-independence supporters who do not see or feel the supposed "togetherness" of the union, while having no problem with the English themselves but specifically resenting, with good reason, the Westminster government. Also the political landscape has significantly changed since the 2014 referendum. Support for independence currently hovers around 50% and those views aren't going away, and they are not all SNP supporters either.

    Abandon all reason

  • From an Italian newspaper on the morning of the UK elections:

    A che ora sapremo i risultati? Chi sarà primo ministro? Tutto quello che c’è da sapere sul voto in Gran Bretagna
    I giochi sembrano fatti, i sondaggi mai hanno oscillato tanto da mettere in dubbio la vittoria laburista
    www.google.com

    "Polling stations open from this morning at 7am in the United Kingdom for the renewal of the 632 seats in Westminster. The game seems to be over, the polls have never fluctuated so much as to cast doubt on Labour's victory. The latest projections speak of a range of seats between 432 and 465, over 200 more than the Conservatives".


    So we knew who won. :/