[SPOILERS] GENESIS 2021 setlist discussion

    Sorry I pressed send by accident.


    Maybe 2 medleys.

    One delicate double 12 string bringing in elements of Stagnation, White Mountain, etc.

    One big drum rhythmic thing bringing together Apocalypse 9/8, Eleventh Earl etc.

    It is quite scary what they can combine.

    By accident I have placed 2 Trespass songs together.

    welcome!


    Some interesting points you make, and the perspective on Phil's voice from the show you attended is good news. I thought mama was a stretch back in 2007 so I'd be surprised to see it this time around. Sadly I think his drumming days are done but you never know I suppose.


    Very interesting thought on Los endos - that would be a powerful way to finish. I'm not a huge fan of medleys myself but you are correct - they've always been a feature of the tours and they are a way to shoehorn in bits of more songs than they otherwise would.

    I agree with much of what Justalawnmower says. You can disguise a lot with backing singers (ask Steve!) but I think Mama may well be off the menu - a real shame as it’s one of the very best in my opinion. I think instrumentals and medleys will feature more and I doubt Phil will pick up a stick but will play some hand percussion. I hope the set will be balanced but I think that means a reasonable balance of post-Gabriel with fleeting nods to the early stuff- that wouldn’t be my choice but it makes sense.

    Very interesting thought on Los endos - that would be a powerful way to finish.


    For me it would be a great finish as los endos, for me, is one of their most powerful live tracks with lights etc .However, if Phil can't drum, then he would be a bit of a spare part, so can't see this happening, but hope i am proved wrong!

    Definitely a very realistic setlist!


    I HOPE they don't start and end EXACTLY like 2007 though... Same intro AND encore? Idk.. haha


    I also feel like they'll play all of Domino but I wouldn't mind it coming in as part of a medley or something else. I wouldn't want it to be like how they treat Firth Of Fifth the past few tours, where it just kind of starts out of nowhere. What about the first half of TTT into The Last Domino? That's a clever way to do the TTT-IT medley that they kept doing haha


    Also I would enjoy a Nic Drum solo, but wonder how it'll start and what it'll go into? Will he start on a bench or chair? haha like the 2007 stool thing, and I would like the drums to go into something new, like The Last Domino!


    Overall I think this is a good realistic setlist. But let's please remove Hold On My Heart ... haha but I guess every set needs a bathroom break song.. This one is almost too obvious though considering it's a "Phil sitting" song hahah what about a "Phil sitting" medley? Man on the Corner - Hold on My Heart - Fading Lights..

    Hi I made an account just because I wanted to share my set prediction. My username is a reference to a steely dan song. It was only after I made my account that I realized it’s not the best username rn so I apologize. Anyways here’s my prediction:

    1. Duke’s Intro
    2. Turn It On Again
    3. Abacab
    4. No Son Of Mine
    5. Land Of Confusion
    6. The Cinema Show (includes snippet of Dukes Travels)
    7. Duchess
    8. Follow You Follow Me
    9. Home By The Sea/Second Home By The Sea
    10. Throwing It All Away
    11. Old Medley: Dance On A Volcano-Firth Of Fifth (solo)-Apocalypse in 9/8(instrumental)-Afterglow
    12. That’s All
    13. Domino
    14. Tonight, Tonight, Tonight (short version)
    15. Invisible Touch
    16. I Can’t Dance
    17. Fading Lights (short version)

    I wonder if I am the only one who doesn't like medleys of old Genesis songs? Those songs told stories, and performing just one verse or half a song means the story isn't told. I do like how they did just instrumental sections of FoF and Cinema Show in 07, rather than shoehorn partial songs into a medley. I still find the 1992 "Old medley" jarring when they stop part way through Dance On A Volcano.


    Phil's voice seemed to get better and better on his recent tour, so once he's in practice again he should be surprisingly good. It actually sounds more full than on 2010's Going Back. But his mobility issues will make for a different Genesis show. Songs like Hold On My Heart will have an intimacy, whereas he won't be doing the old tambourine dance for IKWIL.


    Regarding drumming, Phil has said that he can drum for 10 minutes at a time, but the stage show in the teaser didn't seem to have a second drum kit. Earlier rehearsal photos showed Nic's right handed kit and a left handed kit - presumably for Phil. Maybe he's decided he's not up to it yet? Or perhaps it just hurts too much. He's said that he technically could stand for a two hour show but it would hurt like hell.

    Quote from absinthe_boy

    I wonder if I am the only one who doesn't like medleys of old Genesis songs? Those songs told stories, and performing just one verse or half a song means the story isn't told. I do like how they did just instrumental sections of FoF and Cinema Show in 07, rather than shoehorn partial songs into a medley. I still find the 1992 "Old medley" jarring when they stop part way through Dance On A Volcano.


    ...

    I don’t mind the medleys, even if there are brief excerpts of songs, as long as it flows and seems well-crafted.


    I love the I Know What I Like medleys from the mid-70s to 1980, and I think all the In The Cage medleys were great. I thought The Lamb-Watcher transition worked really well though that probably doesn’t qualify as a medley.


    And then in complete contrast, we have the 92 medley which I thought was a horrible mess. It lacked flow; inserting one or two vocal lines from various songs — the whole piece just seemed like it was thrown together with little thought, care or creativity.

    Quote from Witchwood

    I don’t mind the medleys, even if there are brief excerpts of songs, as long as it flows and seems well-crafted.


    I love the I Know What I Like medleys from the mid-70s to 1980, and I think all the In The Cage medleys were great. I thought The Lamb-Watcher transition worked really well though that probably doesn’t qualify as a medley.


    And then in complete contrast, we have the 92 medley which I thought was a horrible mess. It lacked flow; inserting one or two vocal lines from various songs — the whole piece just seemed like it was thrown together with little thought, care or creativity.

    I Know What I Like medleys?


    Personally I'd count the 82 Lamb/Watcher as a medley and yes it was great, especially actually being there and not expecting that.


    I agree with your first line. I'll always like to hear whole songs but if there is a medley, as you say as long as it's done well I don't mind. And indeed I didn't mind the WCD tour one. It was a little frustrating to get such truncated bits of DOAV and Lamb, admittedly. It didn't come across to me as lacking care or thought etc but it seemed that they maybe wanted to cap it at about 20 minutes but let IKWIL drag on, where they could've given Dance and Lamb a bit more space instead.


    As to the snippets during IKWIL, well it's difficult to argue with you on that score, it was pretty naff and even Collins later said it was a mistake.

    Abandon all reason

    Quote from absinthe_boy

    I wonder if I am the only one who doesn't like medleys of old Genesis songs?

    Definitely not the only one. I'm not a fan, I wish they would play the whole song, and (I think) it's a symptom of the fact that they don't have a rotating roster of songs for a tour, i.e. they have to play half of dance on a volcano and half of firth of fifth every night, because they're never going to play all of dance one night and all of firth another night. I have railed against this kind of inflexibility in their setlists before to the point, I'm sure, of tedium. It's a real first world problem to complain of! I guess it comes from being a greedy fan, and wanting them to play more of their songs. They have such depth across all of their eras. I thought the 2007 setlist was terrific.


    One segue that particularly bugs me was TTT-IT. I love the full version of TTT! Cutting it in half and jumping into IT does nothing for me.


    <rant paused>

    Quote from thewatcher

    Definitely not the only one. I'm not a fan, I wish they would play the whole song, and (I think) it's a symptom of the fact that they don't have a rotating roster of songs for a tour, i.e. they have to play half of dance on a volcano and half of firth of fifth every night, because they're never going to play all of dance one night and all of firth another night. I have railed against this kind of inflexibility in their setlists before to the point, I'm sure, of tedium. It's a real first world problem to complain of! I guess it comes from being a greedy fan, and wanting them to play more of their songs. They have such depth across all of their eras. I thought the 2007 setlist was terrific.


    One segue that particularly bugs me was TTT-IT. I love the full version of TTT! Cutting it in half and jumping into IT does nothing for me.


    <rant paused>

    Also, as we've said before, we know there are bands who keep their setlists fluid and change stuff around - and it's therefore all the more frustrating to have to accept that Genesis simply aren't one of those bands and are firmly in the camp of sticking rigidly to a fixed set. On a tangent - I'm kind of glad they didn't ever do the 2nd half of Volcano after the Trick tour. The first half is a zillion times better and it was surging and powerful live. But I do wish they'd reinstate the whole of Firth.


    I agree about the loss of the TTT instrumental, a favourite passage of mine but many fans never liked it and even the band said it wasn't one of their strongest moments. I thought it brought a refreshingly different trancey feel to their work so it really irked me that they dropped it. The idiots!


    EDIT - I just thought, maybe we should merge this general medleys bit of the thread into that bad-tempered Medleys thread which became rather fractious.

    Abandon all reason

    Quote from Backdrifter

    I agree about the loss of the TTT instrumental, a favourite passage of mine but many fans never liked it and even the band said it wasn't one of their strongest moments. I thought it brought a refreshingly different trancey feel to their work so it really irked me that they dropped it. The idiots!

    I like that description, it is trancey and different for them. I also thought it worked really well on the IT tour, with the tension building up to a dramatic section visually and aurally.


    Volcano does peter out, I agree the first half is certainly better, it's more the general principal of chopping bits of songs up. Not trying to sound too harsh, I do love the band after all, but it feels like their setlist is a bit of a box ticking exercise, where they have to play a piece of something to satisfy everyone. I'd personally be ok with missing out on a whole song I like if I knew they were playing different songs each night (not wholesale changes, but misunderstanding instead of that's all for example. Or cinema show instead of firth of fifth).


    Going further down the rabbit hole, and I know Genesis are very much not this kind of band, but many bands play (or used to least) fanclub gigs where they focus on deeper cuts or even b sides and the like. That bizarre setlist we were joking about with the 2 Battle of Epping Forests would be in play! Well, one can always dream.


    To continue rambling for a bit, I think the big issue for me is that I believe Genesis to be - at their core - actually a very exciting, interesting band. I find their studio music quite expansive and unafraid. I guess I find a disconnect then between their willingness to evolve in the studio versus the stagnant playlists they choose from night to night on a tour.

    Quote from thewatcher

    Definitely not the only one. I'm not a fan, I wish they would play the whole song, and (I think) it's a symptom of the fact that they don't have a rotating roster of songs for a tour, i.e. they have to play half of dance on a volcano and half of firth of fifth every night, because they're never going to play all of dance one night and all of firth another night. I have railed against this kind of inflexibility in their setlists before to the point, I'm sure, of tedium. It's a real first world problem to complain of! I guess it comes from being a greedy fan, and wanting them to play more of their songs. They have such depth across all of their eras. I thought the 2007 setlist was terrific.


    One segue that particularly bugs me was TTT-IT. I love the full version of TTT! Cutting it in half and jumping into IT does nothing for me.


    <rant paused>

    Totally agree about full version of TTT!!


    It would also be good to hear something they've not done live before - Many Too Many (which I think was previously rumoured?), or Undertow?

    Quote from JustALawnmower

    Totally agree about full version of TTT!!


    It would also be good to hear something they've not done live before - Many Too Many (which I think was previously rumoured?), or Undertow?

    Yes, lots of talk of Many Too Many but I'm not sure where that came from to be honest. I don't know why they never played it before, if I had to guess, they couldn't think of a way to finish it (same as what happened to Way of the World on the WCD tour).


    Undertow would be a seriously deep cut I'd be very surprised to hear. Like 'seven stones' surprised!

    Welcome to the forum Snowbound. I think it’s a good name by the way. Your set list is very well thought out as a prediction of what is likely to happen. I’ve not worked out the timings but it feels it might be a bit longer than we can expect. I much prefer material up to and including Duke, but I recognise the band won’t feel the same and neither will much of the crowd, so I think most of your list will be accurate