Corona Virus - Stay Safe

  • "a lazy, incompetent and staggeringly mendacious opportunist who has proved, to the surprise of no one who has ever worked with him, to be completely out of his depth."


    A description of Boris Johnson from a Fintan O'Toole piece in the Irish times this weekend. The Cummings affair is a sadly explicit sign of what these so called leaders think of the people they are supposed to be leading. Trump is a disgrace. I am somewhat glad the state governors have enough autonomy to implement public health measures. Imagine if a Trump/bolsonaro/Johnson figure was in charge of New York...

  • Unelected advisor Cummings, who is clearly the one who's actually running the country rather than Johnson, unbelievably to give a public statement and take questions in the Downing Street Rose Garden at 4pm BST. Yes, a bloke who's effectively a marketing executive known to be a political anarchist intent on making the Westminster machine work the way he wants, is giving a press conference in a manner and location usually reserved for the incumbent PM.


    We are now well and truly through the looking glass. And don't expect any form of contrition from him, it will simply be self-justification.

    Abandon all reason

  • Boris is scared to get rid of Cummings because he relies on him too much. If it was an MP they would have been sacked

    “Without music, life would be a mistake”

  • Boris is scared to get rid of Cummings because he relies on him too much. If it was an MP they would have been sacked

    As I said, nothing unexpected from Cummings. Total self justification, and no apology despite several questioners pushing him to do so. He didn't offer to resign. Then Johnson characteristically evasive and blabbery at the briefing. What a total mess. Yet some are still defending/praising him, them, the government as a whole. The grip of cultism is strong - nothing Johnson says or does can be wrong despite all evidence to the contrary, and if you criticise him it's treated as a form of blasphemy.

    Abandon all reason

  • As I said, nothing unexpected from Cummings. Total self justification, and no apology despite several questioners pushing him to do so. He didn't offer to resign. Then Johnson characteristically evasive and blabbery at the briefing. What a total mess. Yet some are still defending/praising him, them, the government as a whole. The grip of cultism is strong - nothing Johnson says or does can be wrong despite all evidence to the contrary, and if you criticise him it's treated as a form of blasphemy.

    What about the line about driving to Barnard Castle to 'test his eyesight'? As you do...

  • Unelected advisor Cummings, who is clearly the one who's actually running the country rather than Johnson, unbelievably to give a public statement and take questions in the Downing Street Rose Garden at 4pm BST. Yes, a bloke who's effectively a marketing executive known to be a political anarchist intent on making the Westminster machine work the way he wants, is giving a press conference in a manner and location usually reserved for the incumbent PM.


    We are now well and truly through the looking glass. And don't expect any form of contrition from him, it will simply be self-justification.

    Cummings after an interview, even after being pressed had no apology :cursing::thumbdown:


    8o


    Experts believe like the Sars Virus, there is no cure. The Sars just inflated to nothing over time. This could happen to the Coronavirus, if we still self isolate this will be the same, hopefully this will be history.

  • As I said, nothing unexpected from Cummings. Total self justification, and no apology despite several questioners pushing him to do so. He didn't offer to resign. Then Johnson characteristically evasive and blabbery at the briefing. What a total mess. Yet some are still defending/praising him, them, the government as a whole. The grip of cultism is strong - nothing Johnson says or does can be wrong despite all evidence to the contrary, and if you criticise him it's treated as a form of blasphemy.

    But let’s admit this works both ways. The media hate the government & will continue to attack them over everything they do. Even if Boris shot Cummings on live TV he wouldn’t get any credit for it. So why sacrifice him when it would only embolden a permanently hostile pack to demand more? The government certainly mishandled the coronavirus & much of the media’s condemnation is well-deserved, but even if it wasn’t they’d dish it out regardless.


    What’s most depressing is how many people, including those who hate the government, apparently want that same government to micromanage every detail of their lives rather than use their own sense & discretion :rolleyes:

  • But let’s admit this works both ways. The media hate the government & will continue to attack them over everything they do. Even if Boris shot Cummings on live TV he wouldn’t get any credit for it. So why sacrifice him when it would only embolden a permanently hostile pack to demand more? The government certainly mishandled the coronavirus & much of the media’s condemnation is well-deserved, but even if it wasn’t they’d dish it out regardless.


    What’s most depressing is how many people, including those who hate the government, apparently want that same government to micromanage every detail of their lives rather than use their own sense & discretion :rolleyes:

    I disagree. This idea that "the media hate the government" is distorted. I'd say the government have for the most part had a relatively easy ride, especially from the BBC via Chief Johnsonette cheerleader Laura Kuenssberg, and ITV. The contrast was quite jarring when Beth Rigby stepped up to quiz Cummings. And if the government think they're being unfairly treated by the media, the answer is NOT to adopt Trumpian methods and start denying access to outlets they feel are not nice enough to them, as they have done.


    It can hardly be said that the print media are strongly anti-government, in fact until now mainly quite the opposite but it's an indication of the tragic low to which things have sunk that the Mail and various strongly right-wing commentators have turned on them. And don't forget that within the term 'media' we can now include outlets such as Spiked who would definitely find a way of congratulating Johnson were he to shoot someone live on tv.


    I think you may well be right that some of the media would criticise this government even without the pandemic situation, at least I'd hope so as regardless of the prevailing situation this is an appalling administration populated by liars and incompetents and led by a totally self-interested mendacious lazy blustering beachball of a man who has no interest in the necessary detail, hence his pathetic dependence on Cummings.


    If there are harsh critics of the government who nevertheless want them to regulate every tiny aspect of their lives, I'll stand alongside you condemning them or at least tutting and shaking our heads at them. It's an odd thing about the UK - we always say we are a people who won't be pushed around and hate the idea of a 'nanny state' yet the two most successful PMs in recent history in terms of multiple election wins are Thatcher and Blair, both of whom were frequently criticised for being dictatorial and running presidential-style administrations.

    Abandon all reason

  • And Max Hastings is a long long way from being part of some loony left wing conspiracy. I would describe him as a right wing Thatcherite.


    When history is written I reckon 100 years from now political students will see the last election as the final nail in Britain's coffin. We elected Johnson, not because he was any fucking good, but because the alternative was , incredibly, even worse.


    As for Johnson he is an opportunist. He saw an opportunity for himself when the Brexit referendum was announced and, just as Tony Blair did some years before, completely changed his views for the sake of personal opportunity.


    I'm personally sorry, as a conservative, that he didn't become a high profile virus victim when he caught it. Although tbh I suspect he probably wasn't as "ill" as was reported. The man is a cunt who would undoubtedly see a story about him bravely surviving the nasty killer virus as a potential way to raise his profile.


    This Cummings thing makes me sick, how all the rules are laid on us but he neglected them.

  • I know it's not a competition for worst leader but in the last week Trump


    - falsely claimed voting by mail would be corrupt (it's verifiably not)

    - said he would 'overrule' governors with regards opening places of worship despite having no authority to do so

    - said something or other about taking insulin for fun (?)

    - continued to erode whatever faith people have in public health officials by mocking Biden for wearing a mask in public while simultaneously making a point of not wearing one himself (brief side word about masks: they work to reduce droplet spread protecting others from the wearer, no the virus doesn't get 'activated' inside, and no you don't get poisoned by your own co2. Some legitimate issues include inability to wear them for medical reasons or for difficulty with communication such as lipreading).


    I'm sure I missed stuff. Let's not forget his touting of hydroxychloroquine, studies of which have been suspended (doesn't work for covid/causes fatal arrhythmias) and the nonsense about disinfectant which lead to a few cases of poisoning including at least a couple of deaths.


    The "man" is an abomination as a leader.

  • I'm sure I missed stuff. Let's not forget his touting of hydroxychloroquine, studies of which have been suspended (doesn't work for covid/causes fatal arrhythmias) and the nonsense about disinfectant which lead to a few cases of poisoning including at least a couple of deaths.


    The "man" is an abomination as a leader.

    One other is his repeated tweeting of the allegation that MSNBC's Joe Scarborough murdered a staffer Lori Klausutis in (2001?). She in fact fell and hit her head, triggering a cardiac arrest due to an undiagnosed heart condition. This was in a Florida office, while Scarborough was in DC.


    Her distraught widower has asked more than once that twitter remove these tweets as he finds them very hurtful - he has heartbreakingly said "Trump has stolen something that doesn't belong to him - my wife's memory". Trump has repeated the false allegation since the widower made this plea. To make things worse twitter have made themselves look terrible by refusing to take down the tweets as they don't contravene the guidelines. I mean, WTF? They falsely accuse someone of murder! Even Trump's postal-vote tweets got flagged - not removed though - but repeated false accusations of murder don't even get that! How did we end up in this horrifying universe?

    Abandon all reason

  • One other is his repeated tweeting of the allegation that MSNBC's Joe Scarborough murdered a staffer Lori Klausutis in (2001?). She in fact fell and hit her head, triggering a cardiac arrest due to an undiagnosed heart condition. This was in a Florida office, while Scarborough was in DC.


    Her distraught widower has asked more than once that twitter remove these tweets as he finds them very hurtful - he has heartbreakingly said "Trump has stolen something that doesn't belong to him - my wife's memory". Trump has repeated the false allegation since the widower made this plea. To make things worse twitter have made themselves look terrible by refusing to take down the tweets as they don't contravene the guidelines. I mean, WTF? They falsely accuse someone of murder! Even Trump's postal-vote tweets got flagged - not removed though - but repeated false accusations of murder don't even get that! How did we end up in this horrifying universe?

    He has now threatened to 'regulate' Twitter/Facebook/Instagram everything else for 'censoring' conservatives, when all they did, for the first time ever, was put a fact check against one of his lies.

  • Can this really be true? I mean, I wouldn't put it past him...

    Yup, I think he replied to his own tweet in a rage when they flagged it, claiming that he would take action of some sort. Nothing concerning at all about a demagogue threatening a free speech platform, nope nothing at all worrying about that.


    It's like a game show. 'I'll have "how much more incredibly fucked up can everything get" for $500'.

  • Here we go, from the horse's mouth (with deepest apologies to horses everywhere). These are his tweets. An executive order to follow tomorrow apparently. I think it's a little off topic for this thread but not by much... this fracture in public discourse is hugely harmful to any attempt at marshalling a coherent strategy for dealing with COVID19.


    "Republicans feel that Social Media Platforms totally silence conservatives voices. We will strongly regulate, or close them down, before we can ever allow this to happen. We saw what they attempted to do, and failed, in 2016. We can’t let a more sophisticated version of that happen again. Just like we can’t let large scale Mail-In Ballots take root in our Country. It would be a free for all on cheating, forgery and the theft of Ballots. Whoever cheated the most would win. Likewise, Social Media. Clean up your act, NOW!!!!"

  • "Republicans feel that Social Media Platforms totally silence conservatives voices. We will strongly regulate, or close them down, before we can ever allow this to happen. We saw what they attempted to do, and failed, in 2016. We can’t let a more sophisticated version of that happen again. Just like we can’t let large scale Mail-In Ballots take root in our Country. It would be a free for all on cheating, forgery and the theft of Ballots. Whoever cheated the most would win. Likewise, Social Media. Clean up your act, NOW!!!!"

    When Trump was elected we knew it would be an unmitigated shit storm. I have to admit, even then I never imagined he would implement legislation to strongly regulate or close down social media platforms. He is now officially no different from Erdogan, Orban or Kim et al - he has made the move into total dictatorship even by just stating the words quoted above.


    In 2016 I heard Americans who didn't necessarily support him saying that outside the US people of other countries just didn't get how despised Clinton was. I did think when she ran it was a mistake, on the basis that the Clinton 'brand' had probably had its day and probably many in the US thought that too (though it has to be remembered she pulled 3 million more votes than Trump). But disliked though she may have been, would she have lied on a daily basis, acted like a shrieking spoilt child, threatened nuclear war and resolved to regulate or shut down public platforms?

    Abandon all reason

  • When Trump was elected we knew it would be an unmitigated shit storm. I have to admit, even then I never imagined he would implement legislation to strongly regulate or close down social media platforms. He is now officially no different from Erdogan, Orban or Kim et al - he has made the move into total dictatorship even by just stating the words quoted above.


    In 2016 I heard Americans who didn't necessarily support him saying that outside the US people of other countries just didn't get how despised Clinton was. I did think when she ran it was a mistake, on the basis that the Clinton 'brand' had probably had its day and probably many in the US thought that too (though it has to be remembered she pulled 3 million more votes than Trump). But disliked though she may have been, would she have lied on a daily basis, acted like a shrieking spoilt child, threatened nuclear war and resolved to regulate or shut down public platforms?

    i expect whatever he signs today will be a toothless symbolic gesture aimed at firing up his base and massaging his ego.


    Regarding the choice of Clinton I do think the DNC has a lot to answer for. There were many factors in that election result and she did win the popular vote. However the primary was rigged and I'm certain that drove a lot of undecideds towards Trump. They also had a very big grassroots movement for Sanders and that movement's moment was then (as opposed to now). They torched that momentum and put in a candidate that was status quo, and reviled by many. She had done an atrocious job in the state department and made jokes at Gadaffi's ugly death, and was very much seen as the wall street loving candidate. There was an appetite for huge change and the Republicans ended up with that candidate. As a non-american I was surprised Trump won but I understood the vote, or felt like I did at the time. Now I'm not so sure with this war being waged on truth being taken to such an extreme. This 'fake news/post truth' bullshit is paralyzing for society. They make it seem like there are different truths depending on your political persuasion when there's obviously only one reality. And clearly a pandemic wasn't known to be in the works in 2016 when he got in. Clinton would certainly be doing a better job at this. I think she would have had more input from experts and likely not have spouted off about 'cleansing' with disinfectant.

  • It would seem listening to the Radio here in the Uk, that people are now prepared to do exactly what they feel like or are intending to break the regulations. I like probably all of us are getting sick of the isolation but, I’m sticking to it for the sake of keeping people not as physically able as myself safe. I haven’t seen my partner of 15 years for nearly three months now (we both live in separate towns and we ain’t allowed to enter one another place of residence). But due to Dominic Cummins action it seems other people are now using it as an excuse to have people in their homes, parties in their gardens and basically just carry on as we did prior to lockdown. Although I actually was repulsed and felt sorry for him the other day (when the press were all over him like leaches, and seemed to be really putting the pressure on) I feel like he could of at least said sorry I was wrong. And stated it from the heart!, but he hasn’t, It makes me wonder what hold or knowledge has he got about Boris Johnson?. It just doesn’t add up to me how he is still in post?. Amazing how the actions of one man can push others to use it as an excuse to break rules which are there for everyone’s well being?.