Posts by Thelawnmower

As Backdrifter said, at first sight they appear to have gone against George’s wishes. I think Paul said at the time that George gave up on it, saying it was like ‘boiling your cabbages twice’, meaning too much like hard work. The suggestion now is that he thought they would never get John’s voice clear enough. If that’s true then it’s possible that, now we can retrieve John’s vocals clearly, he would have been happy to finish it off, if he were still with us. To me it seems like a nice way to finish things off, but I’ll wait until I hear it.

To elaborate a little now the football has finished…

The Charterhouse four understandably seem to have abiding friendships and rivalries plus a lot of mutual respect. Phil seems to have established himself firmly within those friendships. Steve perhaps somewhere in the middle of the spectrum between friend and colleague. Darryl looks like a firm friend within the three man set up. Chester perhaps more of a colleague. As for Ray, the timing of his tenure would mean that he would really be seen as a colleague on friendly terms - unless they had stayed together for a long time. Maybe he was unrealistically expecting something more.
Whatever the truth- they have all had the sense to be polite and constructive about each other in the main. Society in general could Learn a lot from that.

Quote from Backdrifter

Any joking there aside, to be fair I've mainly heard/read good things about their working relationships with other people. A friend works in the industry and reports positive experiences of dealing with them, and knows roadies and techs who count them as among the best employers. I've read stories of roadies who've had poor experiences with e.g. Pink Floyd, contrasting with how well treated they were on Genesis tours. Another friend worked on Whistle Test at the BBC including the short film they did with Genesis during the making of IT. She worked with a range of artists and said they were by far the nicest (and the worst were the Pogues). But it does seem that one way and another RW could have been treated better.

On a tangent: I heard a caller on a radio show say he was a roadie. The host asked who was the absolute worst artist he'd ever worked with. With zero hesitation the guy instantly, and very firmly, said Englebert Humperdink. He didn't elaborate, nor was he asked to.

yes that’s true I think. I worked with someone who’s friend was a roadie and would run to work with Genesis. There does seem to be something about the way things finished with Ray which doesn’t fit the pattern of their work with other people. Probably more complicated than it seems on the surface. I’ve always thought they come across well in interviews and maybe we make the mistake of thinking of bands as a bunch of mates when really they are work colleagues and perhaps, given their longevity, Genesis have done better than most at being civil to each other.

Yes if that’s how it happened it’s very poor behaviour.

Probably a case of leaving it to the management but it does sound as if they could have done a lot more to let Ray down gently over a few things. To be fair he has said that Tony handled things much better then Mike. Don’t think an upbringing at Charterhouse equips you for empathetic work relationships….

Every bit as good as expected. The musicianship was top drawer and Tony Patterson’s vocals were the best I’ve heard from any tribute band and would have graced Genesis or Steve’s Genesis revisited tours. Catch them if you can. They say this is their last tour and if so good luck and thanks for all the music, but this is such a high quality to walk away from and I hope they might have a re-think in time. I’ve seen them every tour since the early 90s and this is their best lineup. Much as I enjoy the Musical Box I would rather see Regenesis in a smallish venue any day.

Going to Holmfirth tonight. Has anyone been already on this tour? How was it? Confident of a great night.

What a superbly written review! I enjoyed reading it so thanks for putting it together. Wouldn’t disagree with much except to say that Phil’s little diversions during The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway irritate me and I still find the production a little bland. I like the fact they crafted a new running order for the album but would love a complete concert from each of the tours to compete with bootlegs.

Gave up on that (Roger’s Us and Them) I’m afraid. Self-important and boring.

It’s good, I don’t rate it as highly as I think Steve does but it’s a nice blend of prog and pop. I prefer his vocals less treated so in that respect prefer the revisited version. I think he sings well on newer albums, how treated his voice is on those I wouldn’t know but they sound more authentic to me and he sings better in a lower register than he does on Cured for example. This works well live and it would be good to see him write some more catchy and memorable refrains.

When did you buy Selling England By The Pound (or have received it as a gift)?
1980

How old were you when Selling England was released?

12

Was Selling England your first Genesis album? If not, how many Genesis albums did you own before getting Selling??

No i had Live and Foxtrot

If you had to rank all Genesis albums, where does Selling England stand?
number one

Which track was your favourite when you bought the album?
Cinema Show

Which is favourite today

Cinema Show

7. Which track do you think is the best track on the record despite your own taste

Cinema Show and Moonlit Knight

How many versions of the album have you bought / owned? (Vinyl, CD, Remaster, Cassette, SACD etc)
old vinyl, new heavyweight vinyl, remasters cd SACD

Bought it on vinyl when it came out, then later on CD then the SACD box set and then again on heavyweight vinyl. Always liked it, especially Mama, That’s All and Silver Rainbow. And of course Home and Second Home are brilliant. But actually liked it all, even the weaker tracks. I do now have to cringe my way through the lyrics and singing on Illegal Alien, but thank God we’ve moved on and it wouldn’t be done like that today. I did always feel it was a little lightweight compared to Abacab, because of side two, but better than the albums that followed. Mama is one of my top Genesis tracks from any era. Fantastic tour to follow albeit I would have preferred another 15 mins of Genesis to the silly encore.

It’s pretty much perfect, agreed the production could be clearer and the silly noises at the end do nothing for me but it’s timeless and sounds simple even though there is a lot going on. I think in more recent times, in answer to Backdrifter’s question, Peter has suggested that it’s more subconsciously about leaving Genesis than a deliberate theme. But it’s uplifting music and lyrics about being freed to pursue your own destiny make it a winner and impossible for him to drop from a tour list, even if he wanted to. I used to think his live sound was a little too stripped back - it isn’t now - and Solsbury Hill suffered a little from that and I don’t think any live version captures the slight sense of yearning in the original, but that is replaced by an exuberant joy which connects with large audiences each night.

This was the era when I got into Genesis and all the solo stuff. It was odd, just as I was hearing how they all used to sound, they really changed. But as Backdrifter said, this is what makes them so good and also gave them their longevity. I don’t think there is another band/family of musicians that could have given me so much rewarding listening over such a period of time and over so many varied albums and styles. Inevitably some will sound and then age better than others and then even go on to gain a little veneer of antiquity which adds to them. FGTR sounds good to me precisely because it’s the hesitant beginning of a very long journey by a naive bunch of earnest and talented youngsters. I need to listen again to 1984 but the bits I know well have the Philips hallmark of being interesting, explorative and good to listen to, mainly because it’s what he wants to do at that time and that may not be like anything else he’s done. In general (I know this one is instrumental) his voice is weak, some instrumentation irritates me (eg much of the artificial percussion on Slowdance) but there is always more to keep me coming back. I’ve always felt I’d have preferred it not to be called 1984, but I’ll think about that when I have another listen this week.

There’s a bit of a Genesis and Phil fest on BBC Four this evening. Nothing new but may be of interest

Nice song, well arranged and produced and reminded me of Gabriel in many ways. The percussion is reminiscent of something, I think it’s similar to a little riff Phil and Chester used as part of one of their drum duets slowed down a little. A reminder of just what a good voice he had.

Coincidentally I had a couple of gaps in my Phillips collection that I’ve just filled and I listen to him a lot. I haven’t listened to this one in a long while, I’ve been turning towards the first TV three albums and Tarka for some reason so I will give this a spin next

I can’t add much to the very eloquently expressed praise for this track. Everyone is playing at the top of their game here and considering that it was by all accounts a difficult time they sound very together as a band. Maybe their frustrations around the state of Genesis at the time fuelled the fire in this glorious few minutes. Everyone has correctly pointed out the merits of all the players here, so I’ll just add a word about one of my favourite bits of Collins’ playing when he strikes that off beat drum three times (2.16 on the above clip) for no apparent reason - except he knows exactly what he’s doing and why it’s there, just to throw a little extra edge into the mix and to set up Hackett leading the charge into the final phase of this absolute gem.

And the real drums may as well be by the time they’ve been through the system.

It’s such a shame because there are a lot of good ideas that need a bit of room to breathe sometimes

He’s a superb drummer. Steve has great drummers on tour with him but it would be interesting to see Nic with him. Also if he were to play on one of his studio albums it might get us away from the very samey drum sound Steve employs these days

I agree with both of the above in terms of Steve’s excellence on those tracks and others. If it’s any comfort to Backdrifter- Nad has got a lot stronger in terms of vocals as the tours have progressed. His flamboyance is kept in check in the sense that Steve is very much centre stage and I have really enjoyed Nad’s performance on the last few tours- having felt he was a little bit the weak link at the start. As for the mission creep of the guitar- apart from the end of Supper’s Ready, which I’ve enjoyed, I haven’t noticed it on any other songs. If anything it’s the sax/clarinet/flute parts that have been expanded. I would expect a prolonged Waiting Room jam to mop this up but I think Steve’s class will shine through in restraining himself on other songs.