Posts by thewatcher

    Julee Cruise, singer and collaborator of David Lynch, passed away age 65. She had a very distinctive, ethereal style that added hugely to the director's work. Bit of a shock to hear she has died so young. RIP.

    Watched the fourth season of Stranger Things. It's good. The actors are getting a bit old to be school kids but maybe that's an incorrect perception on my part, as I don't actually know how old they are.


    Regardless, the show making is of generally high quality. Well written. It's quite dark and scary compared to what I recall of the earlier seasons, but I haven't rewatched them since their original release. Heavy use of Running Up That Hill which was cool. As always they rely heavily on Stephen King's work (the whole thing is a first degree relative of It) with unsubtle riffs on Carrie this time around.

    It's clear by now that nobody will shift you from this entrenched stance. But it sometimes seems odd to me that fans on this board sometimes speak as though they've forgotten who Genesis were and what they were like, such as their regularly ruthless unsentimental approach to songs and albums. A clear fan favourite is Trick. Across their 6 last tours Genesis played either one, a fragment or no songs from it bar the outlier of 07 (2 songs). For 40 years they played the same single track from W&W bar with the occasional other bit (exceptionally, YOSW a few times in 86). As was pointed out, Nursery Cryme vanished from sets, the blip being 3 mins of TMB in 92. Burning Rope lasted one tour. Etc etc etc. Their entire live history is full of multiple disprovals of your "cherished" assertion.


    What else is there other than the personal views of fans? Is there some definitive Official Gold Standard beyond that? Some music equivalent of an SI Unit? Of course not. So why ask how someone's view of an album can be "substantiated" outside that personal view?

    I like this point very much. Please don't ask me to provide evidence to prove that the album I like is good. It's like asking someone to prove that green is a good color.

    Ugh, there's something so vacant about trying to "define" what a band's classic songs are. Aren't they all just Genesis songs? I like what I like, you like what you like. I've always loved that there's very little consensus about Genesis highs and lows, everyone has different favorite bits.


    Fair enough, you might say Firth of Fifth is a classic prog song, whatever the hell that means, while Harold the Barrel is not. But I don't think there's a formula that defines a classic Genesis song.

    I agree with some points you made, ir was definitely time to make a change and the Album is cracking with energy, I just happen to find the material very poor or thin.

    I think the first time I heard it, I had the same feeling about it sounding "thin". All I could hear was treble and bass, it sounded like there was no mid. It was so different from the Genesis I had heard until then (which would be a mixture of earlier and later Genesis). I grew to love it though, and I'm still most likely to stick it (or the subsequent album) on if I'm in the mood for a Genesis fix and don't have anything specific in mind.

    Feeding the Fire sounds like a very typical Banks lyric. "Many a thing..." etc.


    Anyway, listened to it last night as this thread was going. Top tune. Love the growly guitars and overall dark tone of the music, the passion in Phil's vocal (it cracks slightly on "...come dow-ow-own") and the ethereal bridge. My kind of song!

    I still have John Martyn's Glorious Fool which Phil produced and played drums on, the variety of styles he plays on that album is unbelievable. and I think it was 1980 0r 81

    For me 81-83 was his peak. To my untrained ear the energy and creativity in his playing seemed to crescendo at the same time. He was young and experienced. He was incredible before and after that, just in different ways and with a bit less vigor.

    Phenomenal coincidence about this thread appearing now. I rarely laugh at songs but today - while driving - this ridiculous Sammy Hagar song came on the radio, I Can't Drive 55.


    The first line is "One foot on the brake and one on the gas".


    I was toodling along bringing my kids to their booster shot thinking what would happen to the car if I simultaneously accelerated and braked and how effing stupid it would be. It doesn't help that it's a big cartoonish rock song. I was doing that thing where you laugh inside, with your body shaking at 'laugh tempo' without actually guffawing, as I didn't want my family to think I was insane.

    Very sad to hear about them all, but Ray Liotta especially as I loved his work so much. I think of him as a Christopher Walken type actor, flies under the radar, understated, a bit left field, great.

    As long as US citizens produce art like this I cannot agree with your statements about redeeming qualities.


    We will agree to disagree. Some of my favorite artists are American. The country is a fucking intolerable cesspit. Any country that allows the NRA to exist is the armpit of the world. A cancer on the earth. Bill Clinton once said "there's nothing wrong with America that cannot be fixed by what is right with America". I used to think that was clever and poetic with a hopeful nugget of truth inside it. I now know it is manifestly false bullshit. There is everything wrong with America and nothing right with it.


    Mods - delete this if it's too offensive. I'm too angry to give fuck number one either way.

    One of my favorite Genesis songs. Has been a steady favorite since I first heard it. The lyrics are typically clunky in the way Banks does but the overall sound, tension, performance and the bridge elevate it for me.

    Yeah but it's shite.

    No doubt about that

    I think Stipe's vocal intonations tend to the sorrowful, often giving a general 'down' air to REM's work even when the music is upbeat and/or the song positive, or at least ambivalent enough to not be depressing. I could do that fan thing of listing songs of theirs that don't fit the 'depressing' stereotype, of which there are dozens, but I won't. I'm a fan but if you're not, you're not and don’t need to be "tutored". Suffice to say, I totally disagree with the REM choices offered up as "sad albums".

    I really need to dust off REMs albums again. I always enjoyed their stuff, listened to Up incessantly when it was released, and always catch myself trying to Shazam a song I like on the radio only to find it's REM (this would be for the local college station that often plays their older, more obscure tracks).


    As to the sadness thing, I agree with the above. Up is a great example - it's downbeat and mellow etc but there's a thread of resilience or something that runs through it all, lending to it a sense of hope.


    Anyway enough tutoring on a topic I am not qualified to tutor on. I maintain that Adore is a sad album. Not hopeless, but sad. Some songs lift it up like Perfect, but by the end of Blank Page the vibe left hanging in the air is loss.