Posts by absinthe_boy

Quote from Fabrizio

I don't know, personally I find that really, really, REALLY a stretch and as I said before, I find this debate is veering off course.

I don't see why it is a stretch when it is well documented that Chester became a "born again Christian" in 1980 and due to his beliefs he doesn't indulge in the booze, women or "foul language" that tend to pervade the music scene. What he seems to be saying in the Rolling Stone interview is that Phil's behaviour on that last tour they did was unusual, in part caused by Phil's abuse of alcohol around the time, and it made Chester feel uncomfortable.

There's nothing sinister there. I do feel sad that Chester probably played drums in more Genesis shows than any other drummer, and really hasn't always been recognised by the guys. They don't fool around and have fun with him like they do Daryl. But ultimately all it proves is that all of the guys are human, none is perfect.

Quote from thewatcher

I'd love to see professionally filmed rehearsals. I'd prefer to go to a concert of course.

Not sure about the prospects for 2021. They won't have much data on how long immunity lasts beyond 6 months at that point. When you consider the number of people attending a whole tour and the rules and circumstances in different jurisdictions it could become very complicated.

Here is a situation where lay-people have misunderstood headlines.

There is absolutely no reason to believe immunity won't last. The immune response to the novel coronavirus, as observed thus far, acts just like other coronaviruses about which we know including the SARS-1 from 17 years ago. Patients who gained immunity from that virus either by vaccine or surviving the virus still show great immunity 17 years on.

When a scientist examines samples from people who had covid 6 months ago and finds great immunity, as a scientist all they can say is "we can report immunity after six months".

There's a lot of misunderstanding about antibodies declining too. That's perfectly normal and to be expected. THe human immune response has (at least) two stages/lines of defence. In the months after an infection or vaccine, the body creates antibodies which swim around the body in the blood cells waiting for a new encounter with the virus. After some months the concentration of antibodies reduces and the T-cells retain something one might say is akin to a "memory" within the bone marrow...the body remembers how to make more antibodies should it need to months or years even decades later.

The scientists studying this virus and our immune response cannot say for sure "immunity will last for years" because the first cases were not much more than a year ago. 16 years ago they said the same about SARS-1.

No scientist worth his or her certificates is going to actually say that, because that's not how scientists communicate their findings. But a paper is published "SARS-COVID-2 immunity lasts at least six months" and some news outlets try to spread panic, spinning that to "Covid immunity may only last 6 months, top boffins say! Panic! Disaster! Buy more bog rolls!"

BTW...the above info was paraphrased from the chap who discovered the covid antibodies and from a good friend of mine involved in medical research over 25 years.

Count me as another eccentric. Except I am not sufficiently rich to be eccentric so I'm merely nuts. Men don't keep in touch with anyone outside immediate family? What planet are you from, and do you visit earth often? I put far more effort into maintaining friendships than I do with my family....who in most cases I tend to feel I'm stuck with. I put effort into maintaining friendships with people I hope to keep in my life. In some cases that has meant 45 year friendships in a life, thus far, of 48 years. And let me tell you, it's great for networking too.

Chester specifically said he found the last PC tour unpleasant because Phil was not his usual jolly self and was rude. Knowing Chester's deep religious beliefs it is not a stretch to say that he was probably more upset than some would have been. Especially after 30 years working well with Phil. Chester wasn't aware of Phil's personal problems or the extent of his drinking, so found it all rather confusing and difficult.

I doubt Phil is any more racist than the average person, and possibly less. I've heard he's prone to using the F-word a lot when he's drunk or just during bad periods of his life. Chester is very religions in the Christian sense and that probably doesn't sit well with him. But I get the impression after everything that if Phil called Chester and apologised, all would be OK.

What is interesting is how Chester was clearly never viewed as a member of Genesis by the other guys....which is part of the reason he wasn't asked to do studio work for CAS. In my view that's a big mistake artistically, the album would have been much better with a drummer involved in the writing process. But it also backs up Chester's feeling that he was always a bit of an outsider.

Poor guy drummed on tour for them for 15 years solid and came back for their big "comeback" tour, always put in excellent performances...and was perhaps never truly appreciated by the band members themselves.

Agree on Steve being a class act. He's the only Genesis (ex) member I've met so I cannot directly compare. To be fair they all come across as decent-ish people. But Steve is a lovely bloke and I'm not at all surprised that he and Ant Phillips have become best mates.

In a way it is a shame that Genesis is a band which doesn't do fluid set lists. There are all sorts of pros and cons, but if they are of the opinion that most fans are there for the familiar 80s and early 90s hits, with maybe 20-25 minutes of "old stuff"....rotating a few songs would be a workable way to get more older material done live one last time. Then the whole lot could be released on a live album/DVD/BD featuring everything. I don't have a ticket for a show but I wouldn't be disappointed missing FoF if I got Dance on a Volcano or the whole of Cinema Show instead...for example.

I once had this admittedly rather hair-brained idea that they could do a different side of The Lamb every night.

But that's not how Genesis have ever really done things. They might remove one song they feel isn't working after the initial UK/IRL concerts.

Thinking of medleys and how I generally don't like them, one exception is the "lamb stew" type. They could do a "Lamb casserole" stitching together some musical and lyrical highlights of The Lamb in a 15 minute chunk. Fly On A Windshield would sound awesome in an arena. Let of steam doing a bit of Evil Jam....bookended with the title track and Carpet Crawlers for familiarity. The other exception is Duke Ellington's famous medley which he performed in the 50s and 60s.

BTW I do agree with the band's assessment that much of the audience expects to hear the hits. Despite personally knowing what it feels like to be surrounded by 60,000 people chanting "me, I'm just a lawnmower" I think that for every fan such as myself who might wet themselves with joy if they launched into Hogweed or Stagnation, there'd be three others who would zone out. The Musical Box can fill the Royal Albert Hall for one night...Steve Hackett can do theatre tours based on old Genesis material and the better tribute bands can fill places like Shepherds Bush Empire for a couple of nights but not large arenas day after day.

Definitely out of character, which is why Chester specifically didn't enjoy that period of time.

Regarding PG calling....it's certainly interesting.

Obviously there's a part of me that hopes Peter was phoning to ask "Have you figured out the optimum lighting colour temperature for my flower mask?" but there any number of reasons why he might call. Perhaps Peter was merely doing the band the courtesy of asking how their rehearsals were going? Peter and Patrick worked together in the past on Peter's arena tours, so perhaps they're looking at lighting for a future Peter Gabriel venture?

I wonder if I am the only one who doesn't like medleys of old Genesis songs? Those songs told stories, and performing just one verse or half a song means the story isn't told. I do like how they did just instrumental sections of FoF and Cinema Show in 07, rather than shoehorn partial songs into a medley. I still find the 1992 "Old medley" jarring when they stop part way through Dance On A Volcano.

Phil's voice seemed to get better and better on his recent tour, so once he's in practice again he should be surprisingly good. It actually sounds more full than on 2010's Going Back. But his mobility issues will make for a different Genesis show. Songs like Hold On My Heart will have an intimacy, whereas he won't be doing the old tambourine dance for IKWIL.

Regarding drumming, Phil has said that he can drum for 10 minutes at a time, but the stage show in the teaser didn't seem to have a second drum kit. Earlier rehearsal photos showed Nic's right handed kit and a left handed kit - presumably for Phil. Maybe he's decided he's not up to it yet? Or perhaps it just hurts too much. He's said that he technically could stand for a two hour show but it would hurt like hell.

Fading Lights would be the perfect closer of the set with something more upbeat as an encore. Was Fading Lights one of the songs mentioned in the Prog article last year? I know that's when they poo-pooed the idea of "dusting off The Knife" and talked about doing parts of Supper's Ready.

I happen to think that Hold On My Heart could work well with Phil in his chair, it's kind of a personal song. Sitting on the stool for the 07 tour worked with that song too. But I also agree that it's been done more than enough times and doesn't really stand out in their vast catalogue.

I do suspect they won't deviate a whole lot from the 2007 set list. They've already said that there are certain "crowd pleasers" that they are almost obliged to play. And as much as hardcore fans might cream our jeans at 25 minutes of Supper's Ready, likelihood is that half the audience would get a beer.

But they did give us one genuine surprise in 07, Ripples, so one or two are certainly not out of the question.

We're going to get Invisible Touch, Land Of Confusion, That's All, Hold On My Heart....but perhaps we'll get something unexpected too. They know it's probably their last tour - though I expect them to tour sporadically for up to two years....so one or two set changes are possible.

Regarding the backing singers and Phil singing while seated, maybe I just hang out in the wrong Genesis related facebook groups....Paperlate is now long gone too. But a lot of people have been really upset by the backing singers.

I tend to see it thus.....

"I really wish they'd do something different this time. Do something different with the songs"

Genesis introduces backing singers

"No not that!"

Clearly they've decided to try something new. We don't know which songs the backing singers will be on, nor what exactly they'll be singing but it's pretty standard for bands at this stage of their career. Perhaps rather than trot out a greatest hits live package, we're going to get something genuinely a bit different. I'm sure Invisible Touch and other essential hits will be in there but perhaps presented a little differently....and maybe we'll get one or two genuine surprises. Last time out Ripples was wonderful. If we get more than 30 seconds of something from Trespass, a lot of people would be happy. If we get any 1970-78 song which hasn't been performed in 40+ years that would be fantastic.

The teaser has certainly done it's job of getting people talking.

When I saw those eyes, the first thought was "666 is no longer alone"....but then I thought it looked more like an animal and wondered about Squonk....but the eyes are an evil red and the squonk is shy and retiring.

Some people have suggested Watcher of the Skies which is possible but Peter never had red eyes for that, did he? I can see it could be the "evil" face during the cackling laugh in Mama or possibly a spirit in Home By The Sea. But none of those quite fits.

I've shown the picture to a few people who are not Genesis fans and not familiar with their songs at all....to get the opinion of people who have no pre-conceptions. I simply asked "what do you think this face is?" The consensus was "canine"...one even said "wolf with one bad eye". One person did suggest a big cat like a jaguar. But four out of five had a first thought that it was a canine of some sort.

As unlikely as it still seems, I wonder if it is White Mountain? I'm prepared to bet it is not One Eyed Hound! At this point I wouldn't put money on it not being White Mountain.

The backing vocalists have caused much wailing and gnashing of teeth on Facebook based Genesis fan groups....often by the very same people who ask that Genesis "do something different with the songs" on this tour. For fans of "progressive" music.....some people do prefer to stick Genesis in a sealed jar labelled "1972".

My take is that they are finally trying something a little different on tour, but some people don't like it. I can think of several songs where backing singers would be appropriate, not because Phil can't sing but because the original recorded versions had harmonies or Phil/Pete doubling the vocals. But if they've decided to add some extra vocals to Invisible Touch, maybe it will work? We do know that Tony really doesn't like doing backing vocals, and perhaps he's finally decided "no". Possibly Mike too.

Regarding the unfortunate clash of cates with Steve....I am sure Tony Smith and everyone concerned will have been aware. They will be working with the venues which will have rescheduled every act which wanted to hire them in the last 12 months. It is likely that it simply wasn't possible to avoid a clash or two. I'm sure they're aware that there are a good number of people who would book tickets for both Genesis and Steve.

Well now we know the dates have been posponed.

I think the stage looks great...really imaginative with the movable "dominoes" above providing lighting effects and what looks like front projection plus video screens behind them. It looks more clean than the setup for TIOA.

A few more points/observations

1. They have already spent a lot of money having this stage setup designed and built. We know the design process takes weeks and a LOT of money. The build process likely wasn't cheap either. They fully intend to tour....and to take that stage out more than the small number of dates so far announced. I'm sure they are rich enough to pay everyone off without touring but the intention is to tour....calls to cancel it or miffed fans saying "It's going to be cancelled" are wide of the mark.

2. In all likelihood they'll tour in the manner Phil was touring up to 2019. A few weeks on, a couple of months off to recuperate....a few weeks on again, perhaps a different country/continent. I can see them doing Britain and Ireland first....Continental Europe in a second leg perhaps over Christmas or early 2022....the USA and Canada....taking breaks between legs just like Phil did. What Phil has proved is that you don't need a juggernaut 9 months of constant touring. You can spread it out, giving ample time to rest and see family.

3. I'm fascinated by the imagery in the 50 second clip.

3a. The concrete slabs falling one after another are surely going to accompany Domino.

3b. I think the hundreds of masked men and what looks like some government type building are Land Of Confusion

3c. The red eyes and face.....now this really is interesting. The face kind of looks like the Squonk as drawn on the TotT cover. But the red eyes look positively evil and the squonk isn't evil at all. Could it be for the 666 section of Apocalypse in 9/8? We know at least Phil and Tony want to do part of Supper. Is it Watcher of the Skies? Nic is known to be a fan of this song, and of drumming on it. Perhaps an instrumental version as Phil has never sung this? Is there a small chance it's a wolf from White Mountain? One eye is more red than the other..."one eye"? Or is it a new sinister face for Mama? Or for Second Home By The Sea? It could feasibly fit any of these. Could it even be the Old Man from Musical Box? Though those evil eyes suggest something more sinister.

4. What little we can hear sounds great.

5. Backing singers have caused great consternation. I don't understand why, Pink Floyd had a whole group of them from 1987 onwards. It doesn't necessarily mean Phil can't sing. We know he can. A lot of the Gabriel era songs Phil doubled Pete's vocals or sang an octave higher or did some vocal harmony. The backing singers could be brought on to achieve this. On some later songs Tony sang backing vocals. We know Tony doesn't really enjoy this so perhaps the backing vocalists are there to sing some of his parts? Or maybe they've done some totally new vocal arrangements with some singing of notes (rather than words) on some of the instrumental tracks? Or maybe they really *are* doing White Mountain and they need someone to be the "Anthony Phillips Male Voice Choir".

Thoughts?

Looking at available videos from Phil's recent tour dates, his voice is getting better and stronger. Nope, it won't be 1980 Phil Collins but none of us is getting younger. The band secretly got together to "see if it still worked" and decided that it does work. So Phil's singing must be sufficiently good to suit the material they're intending to perform. Maybe that means some songs will be altered in terms of the key or even the feel of the song. But if they felt they weren't able to put on a decent show and sound good, they wouldn't tour.

In the UK I remember trying to order Strictly Inc about three years after it came out, from my local record store which will basically chase anything you are looking for....and they said it was deleted. This is in the UK.

Err...isn't it Wimpey, not Wimpy.....as in Wimpey the house-building company?

Another part of the narrator's lament, the England of old giving way to soulless concrete and brick boxes.Though it could well be another pun lamenting both the construction company and the soulless burger chain. Our eating habits were also transformed in the early 70s, as a nation we forgot how to cook from scratch, how to use herbs and spices and to make food that actually tastes of something.

Quote from Backdrifter

He thinks Banks made it up? Hahaha! Excellent.

Not that I'm suggesting it's a tricky word to sing but what about 'unifaun'? What's that?

A witty pun

I get that things like "sheets of double glazing" in Domino are hard to sing with conviction and emotion. And "bread bin" is such a mundane object that it too might be tricky....but "undinal"? It fits the melody and timing perfectly and is the perfect word in context of "the siren's call". I'm sure I've heard that Phil won't sing it because be things "undinal" is a word that Tony made up.

Hopefully they're all mellowing in their old age. I think they must realise that this is likely the last tour, or at best they do a two year piecemeal tour like Phil has done. It's the last chance to play/sing those songs.

It is quite sobering to think that even No Son Of Mine is older than the stuff in the Old Medley was on the WCD tour when Phil referred to them as "really, really old songs". Heck....Calling All Stations is older!

Regarding Phil disliking some old lyrics, is there any truth to the story that he won't sing Firth Of Fifth because he thinks "undinal" is a made up word? If so, he needs to consult a good dictionary

Interesting list of songs purportedly rehearsed. A nice selection even if there are some changes I'd personally make. The fact is they're not going on stage personally for me.