A country song? Well, then we need Taylor Swift as special guest.
I wasn't aware she's classified as a country singer but who cares, let's get her on!
Posts by Backdrifter
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Would it be possible to set up a discussion for those of us who opened the link but don’t want to spoil anything for others?
Seconded. A separate setlist spoilers thread was the plan anyway.
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The odd rhythm in D&O has always reminded me of Grand Illusion by Styx. I’ve never been a big Styx fan so I guess it makes sense that D&O has never done much for me either.
If you mean the intro section of Illusion, I can kind of see what you mean.
Nah, Styx had the odd good tune but on the whole I'm not keen and they could be laughably naff and bombastic - which, I got the sense (possibly unfairly) came mainly from Dennis De Young.
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I suspect there aren't many bands with so many releases that would create such different opinions amongst fans. (Based on pure speculation, not empirical research).
I agree, I've often thought exactly this. It's one of the things I really enjoy about this forum, that the discussions reflect the spread of opinion among fans which in itself feeds off the fact there were such different phases in the band's output. Also perhaps to some degree that there is such a diversity of work associated with the individual band members. How often does that happen?
I too can't claim to have researched this extensively but from what I've seen of similar fan boards, while there are areas of debate and disagreement it's nowhere near the extent of what you see on this site.
Back to openers, Musical Box has been mentioned. It's a great song and the closing section is one of my absolute favourite Genesis moments, it played a huge part in my becoming a fan. But I've never been that convinced it's that good an album opener. I'd put it at the end of side 1 and run the album Hogweed - Harold - TMB / Absent - Stones - Harlequin - Salmacis - Happy The Man.
I think DWTMK isn't just a brilliant opener but is the perfect Genesis song and encapsulates everything about them at that stage. If a prog-uncertain person wanted one track to sum up PG-era Genesis I'd pick that one.
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Did you just re-spoiler the unspoilered bit?!
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I agree about AR. Absent the full Dodo Suite to my ear Another Record is the only song from the Abacab sessions that really works as an end piece.
Oh blimey yes, Submarine is the only other obvious end-track, for me.
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That's how I remember it too. I got the impression it was just a throwaway comment - just that he liked it and thought it should be on there. Not like an order or anything. Genesis just happened to agree I guess, and/or felt that his opinion was worth respecting.
I think this is right. Given that they've described deliberately doing a song that was so far removed from their usual sound, and knowing it would annoy many people, I think there was a clear intention to include it and AE's comment probably just bolstered their resolve.
I'm convinced that if they'd swapped Another Record for You Might Recall (and maybe got rid of Whodunnit completely, or replaced it with Paperlate?) it would have had that satisfying flow from start to finish, and it would be considered one of the best Genesis albums (or at least their best pop/rock album)
If you mean a straight swap, ie the album ends with YMR, that wouldn't work in my view as it's not a closing track. I'm not saying AR is a brilliant closer but it feels more of a end-piece than YMR but yeah the latter is the better song by far.
That said, I don't mind AR and quite like the fact it's a bit of an oddity not just on this album but in their work generally. I like the slightly quirky downbeat feel to it and it's interesting hearing the unusualness of a harmonica sound in a Genesis song. Did someone say earlier it was intended to personify their disgruntled older fans? Do we know that or is it surmising? Either way I like the idea, ending their most right-angled turn of an album in that way.
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I agree 100% about Seconds Out. All of those voices babbling at the beginning of side one sound like Sgt. Pepper’s. I’m assuming at the concert in Paris that people actually cheered for the band when they came on stage and didn’t simply sit in their seats chatting like a bunch of high school students before class.
Yes! I've always thought it about Pepper but it hadn't occurred to me about SO, possibly because I simply don't listen to the album so I'd forgotten about that. What a ridiculous way to start a live album. In the Album Covers thread I banged on about how even the front cover is too clean and clinical but in that sense I suppose it reflects the contents. The fuzzy pic on the back cover is far better.
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Cmgin Pynew
Even though I've never seen or read it, that sounds like a character from Game of Thrones.
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Never judge a book by it's cover.
It's a logical enough principle but I wouldn't say never.
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I agree with the comments about Hentschel-era production. Trick isn't too bad, Duke is probably the best of his but W&W and ATTWT aren't good. As mentioned elsewhere I also think that Seconds Out sucked the life out of their stage work. The 07 remasters, of which I know some here are not fans, give a tad more oomph to Three but they're working with poor starting material. D&O could definitely have sounded a lot better but for me the strength of the song manages to punch through to some extent.
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Sides 3 and 4, while still very good, weaken the totality of the album a little.
For me Side 3 ranks as one of the best sequences of songs they ever did, along with the side 1s of SEBTP and Shapes. Practically every kind of Genesis texture and dynamic is in there.
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A friend asks an interesting rather abstract question:
Who, or indeed what, is the opposite of Petula Clark?
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2nd track: Tonight for me, though Duchess very close
Gaaah! What a pillock I am - how the prancing pirouetting hell can I reel off a list of favourite 2nd tracks and NOT include Duchess, one of my top 5 Genesis tracks?!
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Suddenly remembered this previous thread. By the way, not intended as a moan about thread repetition - done it myself enough - but just amused to see I haven't changed my mind since then! To the extent of more or less repeating myself verbatim, no doubt to the disapproval of Variations Enigma fans (see Media thread).
For another kind of variation, see also this live openers thread.
Next step: best album closers? (if not already done).
(To get my vote in early for any possible future Best Second Track thread, it's be a tussle between Fly, Entangled, IKWIL, That's All and Tonight)
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There's a few it's tough to choose from but Behind the Lines probably edges it. The surge of energy it generates right at the start of the album, and something about the sounds and textures, set the tone for what's one of my favourite Genesis albums. It's further boosted by being part of such a good introductory suite, melded with the sublime Duchess and the brief yet atmospheric Guide Vocal. BTL on its own is a great adrenalin rush of an opener, while also being part of a triptych that couldn't introduce the album better. And they made the right decision detaching that whole segment from the rest of the intended longer suite, if it had been more subsumed into a bigger piece it might have lost some of its impact.
So that gets my vote but I have a really soft spot for -
Looking For Someone is a perfect acapella Introduction like Whitney's interpretation of Dolly Parton's I Will Always Love You.
The stark immediacy of it is great (LFS that is, not IWALY). Although, to be Penelope Pernickety for a moment, it's not strictly a capella as it's voice and Hammond together isn't it? Whereas another brilliant opener, DWTMK, absolutely is an a capella opening.
Watcher is a terrific one, but while I love D&O - it's a top 10 track for me - I think it sounds like a great album (or at least side) closer. It's one of the things that makes Three such a frustrating album for me, as the best track is at the start and the rest of the album not only doesn't regain that peak but also sinks to some deep lows.
Lamb is a good one, a nice build-up to the epic album and evoking the bustle of NYC streets in its busyness. Volcano is a very good hail to their new phase but as I've droned on about elsewhere it's spoiled by the second half which I dislike very much. Earl is a logical opener but I don't like the track.
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I'd say the cover was trying to emulate Roger Dean, unsuccessfully, obviously, but that's kind of where it seems to be pointing.
Oh it absolutely is Dean-Lite, as are so many album cover artists who've read the Prog Album Cover Cliches For Beginners primer from cover to cover.
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Nice! Love to see love for these underappreciated gems.
Agreed, and in fact Len's top 3
This ones really hard to do, but:
Nursery CrymeAbacab
The Lamb Lies Down on Broadwayis solid.
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Entagled is one of my favourites for harmonies. I wonder if having the backing vocalists will have a baring on the songs chosen too..
Seen a few mention many to many.. Dont see why that would be included over some others?
Or it could be that the songs chosen has a bearing on bringing in backing vocalists.
Re MTM the mentions of it are a mixture of it having a few fans here (including me) indulging in a bit of wish-fulfilment, the sense that it'd be largely comfortable for PC singing ("got it made" goes high but could be worked around), and the notion that this being a different sort of Genesis than we're used to, some of the normal 'rules' might not apply which in turn might lead to a few unusual/surprising choices, including this one.
