Posts by Midwestdrums

Quote from dodo

Nice, thanks for that info! Can you share any pointers on applying phase inversions? I've tried that a couple times but haven't had too much luck!

I agree it sounds like Phil on "Man of Our Times". Reminds me of how he changes the timbre of his voice for some of the verses in "Dodo"

I can't remember exactly how to get the option, but I think there's a link on the wikipedia entry of Audacity to download the ability to import files in ffmpeg format. You need that to import the files from the DVD. Then, you wait for awhile to get all the tracks imported in from the Video folder from the DVD. Finally, you just play around by putting two of the files together and inverting one of them (by selecting "invert" from the Effect menu).

Having said that, I think one of the files on each of the DVDs are the soloed lead vocals. Some of the backing vocals are in there too.

You're right in that Phil changed his timbre a lot in those days; he was brilliant at that!

A couple of months ago, I had some fun isolating the vocals and instruments (through phase inversions) from the 5.1 mix in Audacity. I think the only place where David Hentschel sings is on “Duchess” along w/Tony and Mike. There’s a soft, falsetto voice in there that I know is not coming from Tony, Mike, or Phil, so that must be David. I listened hard, and I think Phil is doing all the backing vocals on the rest of the tracks; “Man Of Our Times” included.

Quote from The_Genesis_Archive

Ian and others, when you discussing the 2006 and onwards releases verses the 1994/5 and previous versions of the Genesis catalogue. Are you talking about the Stereo only versions?

Nick Davis's word to me was that the Stereo mixes in the 2006 and onwards, where the fold down mixes from the Surround Sound mixes.

The whole Genesis catalogue in the surround format is by example a huge achievement for the fans, but also perhaps one of the first band's to release their entire works in such a format / programme.

The Stereo mixes are never going to be the best representation of the material Genesis have written / recorded, I find such conversations redundant especially when they start going on about compression / mastering etc.

The box set / remixing project was never about the Stereo mixes or the concert / tv era footage of the time, it was always about the Surround mixes and getting them completed and released. The Stereo mixes were contractual through the Record Company.

The previous stereo releases, all have come from reel to reel tape of the copy masters... not the multi track tapes.

Regards

Mark

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Nick confirmed on the old Forum that fold-downs were used for The Platinum Collection. However, Nick also said for the cubed box sets and individual albums, new stereo mixes were created in addition to the 5.1 mixes. For a listening example, if you listen to “Undertow” from The Platinum Collection, and the new stereo mix on ATTWT, you will hear some differences (e.g. the volume of Phil’s harmonies) that are not due to mastering.

Quote from OneForTheVine

YES! This is what I was going for in my original post. (I see we agree about "Duke" and "The Lamb", incidentally.)

I agree with what you said about the remixes, esp. with the DVD-Audio versions of them - IMHO, the way they were done makes them sound a bit too "bright". To my ears, they sound wonderful in SACD, though.

Yes, I guess I should have solicited opinions about the live stereo CDs are well - I'll put my personal preferences here now:

Genesis Live - this is one of those, like SEBTB and ATOTT, that always sounded good. Still, I'll choose the boxset version.

Seconds Out - I agree that it's tough to choose between the DER and the boxset version - they both sound great! Again, lean slightly towards the boxset version.

Three Sides Live - The boxset version again, but I hate that the Ethel Merman outro is edited off of it. So, mostly the boxset version, but the DER for "It/Watcher Of The Skies".

The Way We Walk - again, the boxset version for exactly the reason you gave.

Thank you for putting so much thought and detail into your responses!

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My pleasure!!

I know all the remasters and mixes like the back of my head. I really wish they would've gone the King Crimson/Steven Wilson/Yes route where the new mix is offered on CD and the original mix is on the DVD/Blu-Ray, along with the new mix. Taking the original mixes out of print is something I will never understand.

Personally, I tend to go back and forth between the original CDs and the 1994 remasters. It was fun to hear subtle details that the 2007/08 remixes brought out, and they are great to listen to in 5.1. However, I am not a fan of the compression/limiting used in the mastering stage. It "squashes" the mix, and there's no sense of space, and no dynamics. I'm a big believer in dynamics which is something very few think about in today's music climate. All this being said, here's my preferences for each album:

Trespass: the MCA CD for sound/94 remaster for completeness (MCA has some early fadeouts). The 2008 remix is also fantastic!

Nursery Cryme: 94 Remaster...2008 remix is also very good.

Foxtrot: Tend to prefer the original CD overall, but my copy has the first half second missing of Watcher Of The Skies/94 remaster otherwise.

Live: The original Atlantic CD sounds amazing! 2008 Remix is also very good.

SEBTP: Original and 94 Remaster both sound great to me.

TLLDOB: 94 Remaster

ATOTT: Original ATCO CD

W&W: 94 Remaster

Seconds Out: I have both the 94 Remaster and the 2008 remix. Both sound excellent, and it's hard for me to pick a favorite...despite the remix being louder.

ATTWT: 94 Remaster

Duke: Original Atlantic CD (no contest here!)

Abacab: 94 Remaster

TSL: I have both the 94 Remaster and 2008 remix. I just barely prefer the 94 Remaster...but the remix is also very good.

Genesis: Original CD (prefer the original mix just barely)

Invisible Touch: Original CD (prefer the original mix)

We Can't Dance: Original CD (prefer the original mix)

TWWW: The 2008 remix I prefer just for the fact it's arranged as a proper live show

CAS: Original CD (prefer the original mix)

One of the recent interviews Tony did (I have to look for it...might actually be on Genesis-News.com!), he pretty much said Cherry Red got "cold feet" and he doesn't seem to think they will be going any further with his albums. Pretty sad!

[Blocked Image: http://www.progarchives.com/progressive_rock_discography_covers/833/cover_5650102822018_r.jpg]

Tony’s best orchestral album to date. My 10 month old daughter even enjoys this!

[Blocked Image: http://www.progarchives.com/progressive_rock_discography_covers/191/cover_370412102017_r.jpg]Fantastic new live album from the “Seven-Headed Beast.” The drumming on “Fracture” is astonishing!