that was me 😀
I love this track. Why should this be one of his worst tracks?
It’s not that bad musically, but I’ve always found the lyrics an off-putting mixture of trite & creepy - not the intentional dramatic creepiness of ‘Intruder’, more like leering/ogling at the princess it’s being sung to! Of course, that's just my opinion.
I'll be passing on spectacle of the the fickle left wing media fawning over Doms tittle-tattle after they spent month after month losing their hinges over a car journey to a castle. Why people waste their life watching and commenting on this infantile nonsense is beyond me. Political commentator must be one of the most useless occupations ever invented, essentially carving a living out of agitating the public with pointless gossip. They'll drag it out like Plebgate of course, 24 hour news must be fed.
You have a point. I can’t understand the weird national obsession with Dominic Cummings, a successful campaigner & unsuccessful political adviser whose enemies seem to think he’s Voldemort. In a real own goal, Channel 4 (one of the many media outlets who get so riled by him) even made a TV drama in which he was played by Benedict Cumberbatch, giving him the sort of cachet associated with genuises like Sherlock Holmes & Alan Turing. Why don’t people just ignore him rather than let themselves get so wound up? It's almost as if it gives them a perverse pleasure..... It's baffling to anyone who doesn't really care about him!
I will say that every one of the tracks on this album, the three above included, I think are vastly superior on Secret World Live.
Completely agree with you!
P.S. Can't believe somebody voted for Kiss That Frog, which I'd only vote for if there was a poll on here for the worst tracks PG ever recorded 
Am I the only one who saw the "20 year experiment" comment simply as an in-joke?
Yes it’s very much in the vein of Tony’s comment at the reunion of ex-Genesis members: “Well we managed to sack the whole lot of you!”. Most British people get the humour but it sometimes perplexes others 
Also to the legendary F1 presenter Murray Walker, who presented motorsport for almost 50 years. He was such an icon and much loved throughout the world.
RIP Murray Walker aged 97.
Yes dear old Murray really was a legend, & F1 was never as interesting without him to enliven it. Loved how excited he could sound over some minor manoeuvre (“...and Christian Danner has just overtaken Volker Wiedler for 14th place!”). Murray & James Hunt made a wonderful team.
A shame about Sabine Schmidt too. I remember first seeing her on the old Top Gear driving Jeremy Clarkson round the Nurburgring in under 10 minutes - in a transit van!
RIP to both of them.
I love the notion that Rolling Stone readers are 'cool types', by the way.
I suspect you & foxfeeder are both right: it’s not that the RRHoF really are ‘cool types’, it’s more that they’re convinced that they are - like the BBC types who book acts for Jools Holland’s Later!
Fela is likely getting the votes as much for political reasons as musical ones.
I wondered that too. It’s like Rolling Stone’s 500 Greatest albums of all time list, last updated in Sept 2020. Marvin Gaye’s ‘What’s Going On’ might be the best album ever (I don’t know it, so can’t judge), but I’d be more easily convinced if it hadn’t been promoted to #1 after the 2020 summer of BLM activity created a bandwagon that everyone who considered themselves cool or influential felt compelled to jump on!
Just looked at the current standings in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame official fan vote leaderboard to see Kate Bush is currently 16th & last! The New York Dolls who surely were really influential are only just ahead of her at 15th, & Todd Rundgren is only 9th.
Not that I think the RRHoF is important, I was just surprised
at such low rankings 
His Dark Materials on HBO MAX. It's a series set in Oxford England, in parallel universes. Very cool and lots of strange phenomenon.
I watched the first series but found it quite hard going apart from the odd entertaining moment like Indiana Jones & the singing hare, so I didn’t bother with the second series. Perhaps it’s less of an effort to sit through if you’ve read the books, but the first series didn’t make me want to try.
It’s a Sin on Channel 4, a drama about AIDS in the 1980s, is more interesting albeit preachy in places. The period detail is good at nudging the memory, from the wallpaper through student parties to why did men wear those awful synthetic fawn suits? 
I don't agree the singles themselves became patchy. If that's how you're describing Beauty and the Beast then I'm afraid I'm going to have to fight you.
You often see the same archive clips appear over and over. Don't forget that rock music shows were extremely sparse on tv during the 70s so when they featured big names those clips will be endlessly recycled. As you say, it's nevertheless good to see them. One show ran the superb TOTP clip of Jean Genie thought lost until rediscovered 10 years ago.
That would be a pointless fight - Beauty & the Beast was from the late 70s. I maintain the 80s were patchy, as he released some very good singles then, but none after Absolute Beginners, & some before that weren’t up to the standard of the 1970s unbroken good run that lasted from Changes until Scary Monsters in 1980.
Re the clips, yes it’s a shame the BBC don’t have any contemporary film of Genesis with sound or vision half as good as their Bowie handful from 1972, leaving us with only those few clips from the early 70s on Youtube that have been immaculately refurbished by devoted fans.
"Flop" might be a tad harsh, it was top 30 in a period when his singles performed quite patchily anyway for whatever reason. That lull lifted come the 80s.
....when unfortunately his singles became quite patchy!
I've seen/heard plenty of Bowie commemorations over this weekend, now it’s been Five Years since his death. 3 consecutive programmes on BBC4 on Friday all showed the same 3 tracks (Queen Bitch, Oh You Pretty Things & Starman) from the 1972 BBC archives. Admittedly all 3 are excellent & bear repeated watching, but it was interesting to see & hear some lesser known songs & clips too on other channels.
Due to the adverse conditions this year, lots of musicians have decided to use their enforced spare time to release Xmas singles or - worse still - whole albums that are now cluttering up the playlists of some radio stations & crowding out those few old Xmas records I actually like such as Greg Lake, Jonah Lewie, Mike Oldfield & the Waitresses. I haven’t heard a single one of these new offerings that deserves to get airplay next Xmas, let alone in decades to come, especially the ones that rub in what a horrible year it’s been & how we all have to use Zoom (thanks Robbie Williams!) 
FFS, is it the mid 1970s already? There's no room for this on this board, or at least I'd have hoped but it's being liked so perhaps I'm in a minority.
You’ve missed the difference between UK & North American terminology. To the latter, poof means a theatrical or flamboyant person. We discovered this on the previous Genesis fanboard years ago when a North American member posted a comment about Nad Sylvan’s poofy hair, meaning his extravagant coiffure!
I've Never Been To Me by Charlene, the ultimate anti-feminist song. You silly woman, you go on home to your hubby and don't be like poor me who 'moved like Harlow in Monte Carlo where I sipped champagne on a yacht' and was 'undressed by kings and seen some things that a woman ain't supposed to see'. I am ashamed I can still remember those lyrics.
If you think that’s bad, you might also dislike “One day at a time” by Lena Martell. 40(?) years after it topped the UK charts, I still can't stand it!
Sadly this is true, and equally sadly the exact same is true of many on the right who despise everyone who don't share their views, and automatically dismiss them as 'woke' or 'libtards', 'luvvies' etc. This is all too often the level to which so much discourse has sunk, with each side dug in deep and refusing to give any ground as they shriek insults at each other.
On social media I sometimes engage with people of opposing views, which tend to be right-wing as I identify as liberal. It's rare that I can have a reasoned discussion as often even the initially most reasonable people quickly resort to insults and condemn me as a loony leftie. I'm know I'm far from alone in this, and equally I try to discourage those who share my views from doing the same in the opposite direction.
Both in the UK and the USA there has grown a huge division in society. I don't see any hint of those schisms being healed in the foreseeable future, especially with leaders who choose to deepen those divisions.
Yes unfortunately some on both sides take a positive pride in not even trying to understand their opponent’s viewpoint, as if that was a virtue. The mutual hatred & polarisation predated Trump’s election, but of course he’s emphasized it for his own benefit. Although Biden himself won’t do that, it’s unlikely that he’ll be able to prevent his followers from continuing the antagonism, so I can’t see matters improving with Trump’s departure
All good songs you list up there, just overplayed I would say.
That’s a good point. I hate most records that are played incessantly as you can’t escape them for a period, although sometimes you look back later & think maybe they weren’t too bad after all. So now I quite like Le Freak by Chic although I hated it when it came out, but I still hate Happy by Pharrell & almost everything by Adele!
I think the 'left' for lack of a better term, at least in the US it seems to me, view themselves as inherently pure and correct. I agree much more with their policies but really dislike the moral posturing and all this woke bullshit going around. Neither side owns common sense or decency.
You’re absolutely right, & it’s not just in the US. Many on the left in the US & the UK despise anyone who disagrees with them for whatever reason, & simply brand them as stupid or racist. It makes you wonder how many ordinary Republican & uncommitted voters chose to vote for Trump, or Boris in the UK, because they were sick of being the butt of this dismissive, patronising attitude from those who consider they have a right to rule because of their moral superiority.
“Mystify” a documentary about Michael Hutchence of INXS, re-shown on BBC4. An odd combination: it was overlong & the first part dragged, but the second part was the proverbial slow-motion car-crash footage where you know what’s coming but you can’t stop watching.
Steve is the latest artist to be made a subject of one of these books, details here: https://burningshed.com/store/…eve-hackett-on-track_book though that link is for the hardback (and signed by the author).
The author is Geoffrey Feakes, whose other books in this series are the Moody Blues (I have that one) and the Who.
That looks ideal for the completist.
Presumably you’ll be getting a copy as a Xmas present?
I’ll add the late, great Rutger Hauer.
Also Colin Firth, John Cusack, & for comedies Hugh Grant.
Yeah the 'yah' song is (I think) Digital Witness which I like but totally get why the yahs might annoy some people. I don't recall her lying on her back on the show though, but anyway. As a fan I was going to say it's a pity if that alone put you off but then I thought there's so much stuff out there it can take just one annoying thing to consign an act to the bin - I'm sure I've done it myself. Stilted, mannered movements certainly form a big part of her live act for sure but I don't think of it as attempted coolness rather than an artifice in the same way flower masks and surreal stories are.
By the way we seem to have assumed that Later has some sort of "cool ethos". Has it? Really? I can't say I've ever spotted it myself!
Thanks for the LTs pointers, I'll check them out. But if any of them have annoyingly mannered quirks of any kind I'll be straight back to let you know about it!
Sorry, I should clarify I don’t think 'Later' is cool - the “cool” ethos mentioned was something foxfeeder pointed out:
"Referring back to the thread title, keeping it real and musical snobbery, I tend to find Jools Holland's show on BBC2 is a bit too "cool", ie/ if you aren't one of "us" you won't be on this show." (NB I've just found out this site gets confused if you try to quote something from a previous page in mid-reply!)
Hence it seems to me that some of the non-top-billed acts try to act “cool” to justify their place on the show, & end up being irritating.
Since the non-top-billed acts only get one song apiece per episode, if you don’t much like that particular song you’re more likely to notice annoying mannerisms or appearance & be put off the act. But then a 1973 film clip of an oddly-dressed man pretending to be a lawnmower on stage might annoy people who don’t like the accompanying song, while the others end up on this fansite
Anyway, after finding “Digital Witness” on Youtube now I know the title, it’s better than I remembered & those irritating “yahs” seem quieter. So yes, negative impressions based solely on 'Later' performances can be misleading.
