And regarding Swift, she will keep working but her status will be quite lowered. She is not as horrendous as Sheeran and Bieber but she is not by any means one of the greatest artists alive.
Sales database
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Ultimately it's irrelevant what a small gaggle of bellyaching Genesis fans think of Sheeran or any of the acts mentioned earlier in this thread, or what the ratio of solo-written to collaborative songs is, as though that's some kind of sacred standard.
1: I don't have any collywobbles.
2: It is quite known that Sheeran has a plagiarism tendency or at least he is fond of taking musical melodies, 'movements' or pieces from other artists and presenting them as his own without any acknowledgement.
3: It is a proofed fact that he doesn't sing, he babbles.
To be continued...
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4: Until around 2010, official album charts worldwide were based only on physical sales. But since then they also include downloads. And that brings a huge risk: the number of downloads of a certain album or artist could be swollen. This has already happened with reality shows' phone polls where the network/the show production team have used an IT programme that enables a computer/several computers to make multiple calls for the whole day to the number of the preferred candidate. Who can say this is not possible in the official hit lists now? A specific album or performer may be 'doped up' and get a higher position than the one through actual sales. Adding to this the fact that the reliable (and not-so easy to manipulate) physical sales are now increasingly displaced for the headcount. All of this makes the official charts not the reliable tool on musical tastes that were.
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5: Ed Sheeran can't sing
He can't dance
He can't talk
There is nothing about him, he can't even walk
He can't sing
Although trying, he can't sell anything
Oh, check everything is in place
You never know what's going onWith that imperfect body with that imperfect face
Mhm. -
I don't have any collywobbles.
Well you've certainly collywobbled all over this thread 🤣
QuoteTo be continued...
I really hope the half hour since your last emission means you've sponged yourself off and gone for a sandwich and a milky coffee
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5: Ed Sheeran can't sing
He can't dance
He can't talk
There is nothing about him, he can't even walk
He can't sing
Although trying, he can't sell anything
Oh, check everything is in place
You never know what's going onWith that imperfect body with that imperfect face
Mhm.I get it. Although the 'trying, he can't sell anything' line makes no sense given that he has in fact sold millions.
But this is only your opinion, remember. He has a large fan base. To each their own. You can't just sit all his fans down and insist to them 'you mut not listen to Ed! You must listen to Genesis'!
Those of us who can remember the punk rock era when prog bands were dumped on from a great height by all and sundry would hopefully try to be more accepting of 'younger people's tastes'.
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I get it. Although the 'trying, he can't sell anything' line makes no sense given that he has in fact sold millions.
But this is only your opinion, remember. He has a large fan base. To each their own.
Also, there's been a couple of accusations in this thread of his being a plagiarist. On the two occasions he's been taken to court over alleged plagiarism, he's won. Before this, the first time he was challenged he settled out of court on the advice of his lawyer, which he then later regretted and wished he'd pursued the case to clear his name. As sometimes happens with hugely successful artists (such as bestselling authors as well) he's had many legal challenges, no doubt following his out-of-court settlement, by people hoping to get a similar payout.
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I get it. Although the 'trying, he can't sell anything' line makes no sense given that he has in fact sold millions.
I was just playing with the I Can't Dance lyrics, for selling I did not mean records but endorsed products, sorry for not explaining enough. For example, Heinz Ketchup's sales lowered since that ad featuring Sheeran.
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He has a large fan base. To each their own. You can't just sit all his fans down and insist to them 'you mut not listen to Ed! You must listen to Genesis'!
I'm not trying to change the tastes of the others (in the same way that I don't want my tastes to be changed). But what can't be denied is that Mr Sheeran lacks talent, to put it mildly.
I'm not saying that all teenage pop, not at all. You can find a lot of (very) good singers in that genre. But I'm saying is that either Sheeran or Bieber are certainly not one of them.
The Spice Girls at their time were far more relevant and nowadays the most charismatic member is on the spotlight just for being the wife of the head of a F1 team (Red Bull). That was the point of my initial comment that it is quite probable that they will be largely forgotten in a few years.
And last but not least, Collins has sold far more than Sheeran, Bieber and the Spice Girls put together and has a larger fanbase. But, alas, this has not been prevented a sick vilification campaign towards him from the 90s onwards by some certain media-players
. And what is undeniable is that Mr Collins has been a far more important and emblematic than Sheeran, Bieber, the Spice Girls and Swift together (both solo and with Genesis). -
Also, there's been a couple of accusations in this thread of his being a plagiarist. On the two occasions he's been taken to court over alleged plagiarism, he's won. Before this, the first time he was challenged he settled out of court on the advice of his lawyer, which he then later regretted and wished he'd pursued the case to clear his name. As sometimes happens with hugely successful artists (such as bestselling authors as well) he's had many legal challenges, no doubt following his out-of-court settlement, by people hoping to get a similar payout.
It was not that Sheeran was exonerated as that the judge argued that it could not be 100% proven that there had been plagiarism and with intent by Sheeran. This was due to a twisting of the rules as presented by Sheeran's more expensive lawyers. It has to be reminded that this took place with the appeal as the plagiarism had been confirmed indeed in the first instance.
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the judge argued that it could not be 100% proven that there had been plagiarism and with intent by Sheeran.
Right there, that's the key fact. The rest is just you dribbling vitriol.
Had that sandwich and coffee yet?
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I don't drink coffee at all. And thank goodness I don't have any digestive problems. But thanks for your interest.
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I'm not trying to change the tastes of the others (in the same way that I don't want my tastes to be changed). But what can't be denied is that Mr Sheeran lacks talent, to put it mildly.
I'm not saying that all teenage pop, not at all. You can find a lot of (very) good singers in that genre. But I'm saying is that either Sheeran or Bieber are certainly not one of them.
The Spice Girls at their time were far more relevant and nowadays the most charismatic member is on the spotlight just for being the wife of the head of a F1 team (Red Bull). That was the point of my initial comment that it is quite probable that they will be largely forgotten in a few years.
And last but not least, Collins has sold far more than Sheeran, Bieber and the Spice Girls put together and has a larger fanbase. But, alas, this has not been prevented a sick vilification campaign towards him from the 90s onwards by some certain media-players
. And what is undeniable is that Mr Collins has been a far more important and emblematic than Sheeran, Bieber, the Spice Girls and Swift together (both solo and with Genesis).I will just repeat that opinion is not fact, and while I agree that Phil has been unfairly villfied, that is hardly the fault of artists like Sheeran & Bieber. We seem to be getting into another area now.
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I will just repeat that opinion is not fact, and while I agree that Phil has been unfairly villfied, that is hardly the fault of artists like Sheeran & Bieber. We seem to be getting into another area now.
Understood! As I said before, I was just playing with the I Can't Dance lyrics. And my perception is that certain performers are being appointed by the media with far more importance than what they really have (and perceived by the general public). Going on, yes, you're right. This topic keeps snowballing and this is something I do not want either.
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what can't be denied is that Mr Sheeran lacks talent, to put it mildly.
What all your elongated babbling means when boiled down is simply that you don't like Sheeran and therefore make ludicrous dogmatic statements such as above, turning your personal opinion into supposed fact by putting "what can't be denied" in front of it, and that you're a gushing Collins fanboy who thinks he can do no wrong. It's a lot quicker to just say that.
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What all your elongated babbling means when boiled down is simply that you don't like Sheeran and therefore make ludicrous dogmatic statements such as above, turning your personal opinion into supposed fact by putting "what can't be denied" in front of it, and that you're a gushing Collins fanboy who thinks he can do no wrong. It's a lot quicker to just say that.
You've got the wrong place this is the Genesis Forum not the Ed Sheeran Forum.
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And Phil Collins is a great artist.
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And what is undeniable is that Mr Collins has been a far more important and emblematic than Sheeran, Bieber, the Spice Girls and Swift together (both solo and with Genesis).
I don't wish to become embroiled in whatever is going on here but wanted to comment on Swift, seeing as my daughters and all their friends are completely obsessed. I've therefore listened to an awful lot of her music without seeking it out. I openly confess I don't fully get it, but I totally respect her. She's an absolute phenom. She's in her 30s, a completely self-made billionaire who's released 11 albums I believe, including rerecordings of several of them to overcome some copyright issue? Say what you want but I don't think Collins is "more important" or emblematic, whatever that means. I don't think she is either. I think they both worked incredibly hard and are both incredibly talented and have had massive success, his 30-40 years ago, hers now. I think any attempt at making a hierarchy is pure fabrication. Including Sheeran, Bieber, spice girls or anyone else you want to throw into the mix.
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Very well put thewatcher .
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Could we please stick to discussing Genesis in this Genesis forum? There are lots of fan forums out there for all the artists mentioned in this thread, anyone is welcome to join an Ed Sheeran forum and tell people there how relevant or irrelevant their idol is. For perspective, I'd suggest to tell people in Metallica/Slayer/Iron Maiden forums something about the relevance of Phil Collins or Genesis. See how they will react.
