re-issues in the near future?

Quote from last-domino

That's it! And I doubt anyone is wiling to pay the bills to do the job. Which is a shame really. Wembly, No Ticket, Way we walk... plenty of stuff worth rereleasing in HD. Even First final farewell tour. Let alone When in Rome, which IS available in HD.

As I recall, they DID release the Three Sides Live concert (with all the interviews) as a blu ray...I wonder why did they stop there? I know PG released his concerts in blu-ray, at least the older ones (before Up)...if they thought that was worth it, I'd imagine there'd be just as big a market for Genesis' concert releases-if not bigger. I would LOVE to see Lyceum, Wembley, TWWW and even Phil's Seriously Live in Berlin in 1080P!!

I believe the problem with The Mama Tour is they don't have access to the original camera film, only the videotape master, which would impossible to get an actual HD product from.

The Invisible Touch Tour was filmed on HD video tape, which allowed (once they found a vintage machine to read the tape) an HD video source to work with. If they made a new digital master when they transferred the tape for the white box set a BluRay would be possible.

As far as I know the problem with The Way We Walk and Serious Hits Live is they were filmed on standard definition video tape, so there is no way to get a true HD video from the original footage. In these days of AI upscaling I suppose anything might be possible, but someone would have to be monetarily interested in taking on the work.

Quote from WinstonWolf

I believe the problem with The Mama Tour is they don't have access to the original camera film, only the videotape master, which would impossible to get an actual HD product from.

The Invisible Touch Tour was filmed on HD video tape, which allowed (once they found a vintage machine to read the tape) an HD video source to work with. If they made a new digital master when they transferred the tape for the white box set a BluRay would be possible.

As far as I know the problem with The Way We Walk and Serious Hits Live is they were filmed on standard definition video tape, so there is no way to get a true HD video from the original footage. In these days of AI upscaling I suppose anything might be possible, but someone would have to be monetarily interested in taking on the work.

interesting ... but this may also mean nothing will happen - the days of large sales for concert film physical media are obviously over, So who would be willing to pay the bills when there is no return of investment?

Quote from WinstonWolf

I believe the problem with The Mama Tour is they don't have access to the original camera film, only the videotape master, which would impossible to get an actual HD product from.

The Invisible Touch Tour was filmed on HD video tape, which allowed (once they found a vintage machine to read the tape) an HD video source to work with. If they made a new digital master when they transferred the tape for the white box set a BluRay would be possible.

As far as I know the problem with The Way We Walk and Serious Hits Live is they were filmed on standard definition video tape, so there is no way to get a true HD video from the original footage. In these days of AI upscaling I suppose anything might be possible, but someone would have to be monetarily interested in taking on the work.

Admittedly I don't know much about HD conversion...but if standard def tape can't be converted to HD, then how were so many other media able to be given a digitized (and subsequent 1080p) treatment? Surely the Genesis and Phil Collins concert footage isn't the only video footage out there that used this difficult format-yet there have been lots of other productions-both concerts and other media-that were able to be upscaled or digitized, coming from all kinds of different sources?

What was the Three Sides Live film originally filmed with? Also: What was the original format of that Genesis Bataclan 4K remaster that has been floating around lately? I can't imagine that having been filmed with something other than standard def video (as it was in 1973), and that release looks amazing! IMO if such a thing could be done with THAT release, I don't see why ones that are decades newer couldn't also...?

Quote from BillysNumber

What was the Three Sides Live film originally filmed with? Also: What was the original format of that Genesis Bataclan 4K remaster that has been floating around lately? I can't imagine that having been filmed with something other than standard def video (as it was in 1973), and that release looks amazing! IMO if such a thing could be done with THAT release, I don't see why ones that are decades newer couldn't also...?

The older footage was shot on film, not tape. Film has a lot of extra "resolution" when compared to digital formats, so even an 8K scan of something shot on 35mm film is still reducing the possible visual information.

By the early 90s a lot of recording was done on standard def video tape because it was cheaper and even DVD-level hi def wasn't really being considered very much. Which sadly means things like Serious Hits, The Way We Walk (and Pink Floyd's Pulse) aren't capable of getting a true HD video release.

One release that (sorta) sidestepped that problem is Secret World, which was shot on film, but 16mm, so that's also why the Bluray is grainy AF, because 16mm film really doesn't hold up well either when remastered into hi def...

Quote from WinstonWolf

The older footage was shot on film, not tape. Film has a lot of extra "resolution" when compared to digital formats, so even an 8K scan of something shot on 35mm film is still reducing the possible visual information.

By the early 90s a lot of recording was done on standard def video tape because it was cheaper and even DVD-level hi def wasn't really being considered very much. Which sadly means things like Serious Hits, The Way We Walk (and Pink Floyd's Pulse) aren't capable of getting a true HD video release.

One release that (sorta) sidestepped that problem is Secret World, which was shot on film, but 16mm, so that's also why the Bluray is grainy AF, because 16mm film really doesn't hold up well either when remastered into hi def...

Correct. Anyone who ever had a 110 format camera will know how little resolution a small format like 16mm has. Producing HD releases of stuff available on DVD is pretty pointless, since most DVD/BluRay players upscale anyway, doing what you'd be paying someone to do remotely for you what your player does anyway.

I really don’t understand why whoever does these re issue campaigns doesn’t look into reissuing all of the back catalogue of the 2007 stereo reissues or, even better transferring those three boxes to blu ray and releasing it all on one nice package. They could fit everything I would think on 3 - 5 Blu-ray Discs maybe less than what was on the green/red and blue sets. they could make it even better by including the large Genesis book in a square shape to match the usual super deluxe box sets and I’d be a happy camper! - they could gladly take £150 - £175

Of my money now!. Will it happen no chance!!. Something like a Pineapple Thief Earbook style would be something to appreciate. But I doubt anything like this will happen not within the next 5 years!. Why they don’t I find puzzling for such an iconic band it’s such a shame.

Quote from Wayne

I really don’t understand why whoever does these re issue campaigns doesn’t look into reissuing all of the back catalogue of the 2007 stereo reissues or, even better transferring those three boxes to blu ray and releasing it all on one nice package. They could fit everything I would think on 3 - 5 Blu-ray Discs maybe less than what was on the green/red and blue sets. they could make it even better by including the large Genesis book in a square shape to match the usual super deluxe box sets and I’d be a happy camper! - they could gladly take £150 - £175

Of my money now!. Will it happen no chance!!. Something like a Pineapple Thief Earbook style would be something to appreciate. But I doubt anything like this will happen not within the next 5 years!. Why they don’t I find puzzling for such an iconic band it’s such a shame.

RE: The highlighted, I believe they are actually doing that aren't they? On the main news page there's that article that their reissuing all the albums. Albeit not with the extras.

Honestly at this point, I'm pretty happy with what I have: the 2018 half-speed vinyl reissues. I know the quality does have some subjectivity across the fandom, but IMO they sound amazing on vinyl. Those take the remixes and between the vinyl format and the half-speed mastering, opens up and balances the sound. IMO this is the way the boxset stereo mixes SHOULD have sounded.

Having not become a Genesis fan until the mid 90's when I was in middle school, the ''94 remasters are what I was more or less 'introduced to' for their back catalogue-and I always did feel those sounded a bit muddy, and in places 'smashed together.' So I was happy when the boxsets came out. IMO those remixes-despite some compression issues on certain songs in the blue boxset-brightened, deepened and gave all of the songs more 'room to breathe.' Just when I thought that was good, I then got into vinyl two years ago and after listening to the vinyl versions I was blown away! Genesis, W&W, SEBTP, Duke, all of the albums had this richness, balance and expanded dynamic range that I'd never experienced before with Genesis' material!

So as much as I would love some new material from them, the only re-issues I will ever get is if they someday release remastered versions of the ORIGINAL mixes of all these albums-and I'm sure it'd be a new experience all over again.

Apologies I was basically referring to the high resolution files on the SACDs, not the basic 16/44 or 24/44 that are recently announced. Thanks though.

The SACDs sound great to me in stereo at that 88 bit rate, on Blu-ray Discs of 50gb I imagine they could probably fit 5 albums per disc?, and do the full discography over 4 discs. It would fit just right on the ear book format 4 discs on a page. It would be great having everything in one package - job done, no need for 4 boxes for the three studio sets and one live set, they could do it all in one set on bluray. Probably making a lot of money In the process, plus make a load of fans very happy.

My guess, as with other decisions or lack of decisions, is that:

1. Someone has calculated that there wouldn't be adequate return on investment to do this kind of re-release. I'm guessing the market for Blu-ray releases isn't sufficient to warrant releasing these versions.
2. No one in the band cares enough to be more actively curating their catalogue further.

Quote from Wayne

Probably making a lot of money In the process

No, in fact probably not.

Quote from Wayne

Probably making a lot of money In the process, plus make a load of fans very happy.

I also disagree about this. The original box sets were released in 2007, when the band was again fairly prominent due to the TIOA Tour. None of them achieved any of the silver/gold/platinum statuses of sales in any country that I am aware of. So that is not likely a great return on investment, since a lot of work went into creating these box sets, including the interviews for each album. I wouldn't be surprised if these sets actually lost money.

Nowadays, the band pulls in even lower sales. The Last Domino?, their latest hits collection, didn't achieve any silver/gold/platinum status either. It was only a double-CD. Unfortunately, I can't imagine that some kind of re-release of the box sets would lead to significant sales.

It’s interesting as currently Genesis is are the number one selling item on acoustic sounds , both of the recent re issues have both sold out. Plus there is an incredible demand now for high resolution re issues. You also have to consider why Genesis are selling out on Acoustic Sounds?. I myself think there is demand they have got a lot of new fans since 2007. I think it would be worth a shot?. Plus as you say the work has already been done.

Quote from Wayne

It’s interesting as currently Genesis is are the number one selling item on acoustic sounds , both of the recent re issues have both sold out. Plus there is an incredible demand now for high resolution re issues. You also have to consider why Genesis are selling out on Acoustic Sounds?. I myself think there is demand they have got a lot of new fans since 2007. I think it would be worth a shot?. Plus as you say the work has already been done.

That is interesting. My question is how big a reach does Acoustic Sounds have? What does selling out mean in terms of numbers? Dozens? Thousands?

We live in an era where owning physical music is not really a thing, except for maybe vinyl and for us crotchety old dinosaurs. Most people stream and aren't looking to own CDs and blu-rays. While there is an audiophile market, is it enough to motivate Genesis management to work on more releases?

Quote from Dr. John

We live in an era where owning physical music is not really a thing, except for maybe vinyl and for us crotchety old dinosaurs. Most people stream and aren't looking to own CDs

I'm not even 35 and I'm keen on owning physical music. I love having my own CDs. They are a reliable format.

Quote from Dr. John

That is interesting. My question is how big a reach does Acoustic Sounds have? What does selling out mean in terms of numbers? Dozens? Thousands?

We live in an era where owning physical music is not really a thing, except for maybe vinyl and for us crotchety old dinosaurs. Most people stream and aren't looking to own CDs and blu-rays. While there is an audiophile market, is it enough to motivate Genesis management to work on more releases?

Although I haven’t got any figures, from what I have read and seen the number probably would be in the 1,000s by now for both the Lamb and Selling England, the later I would expect being cheaper has sold considerably more than the Lamb. Both titles were numbered up to a certain amount my lamb which I have had for 6 weeks was 1,300 approx, were as selling England didn’t have a number so all those must have sold out before I got mine. Chad the owner of AS says the Genesis have sold very well and they can’t keep up with demand, and they have lots of customers waiting for a re press of both!. Getting back to the three boxes, I think as the work has already been done, repackage those three boxes into one and take my money, seems ridiculous that all that work was done only to release on the one occasion?. It can all be transferred to blu ray and also save a lot of packaging to boot. Folks are also getting excited about foxtrot and Nursery Crime but the demand has been that popular that these titles have been pushed back. Talking of Selling England going to the Musical Box show tomorrow night, Have seen it in the past of course.

Quote from IWishItWouldRainDown

I'm not even 35 and I'm keen on owning physical music. I love having my own CDs. They are a reliable format.

That's great! And unfortunately doesn't appear to be what the majority are doing. I think revenue from physical music is about 10% of the music market now, with the vast majority coming from streaming.

Quote from Dr. John

That's great! And unfortunately doesn't appear to be what the majority are doing. I think revenue from physical music is about 10% of the music market now, with the vast majority coming from streaming.

I'm 42 and avidly attached to my physical media (I recently set up a VCR 😆). That said, I stream a lot for convenience - mostly while commuting - and I find it excellent for discovering new music, along with the local college radio station. If I find something I like on streaming I'll typically go and buy it then.

It may also be a consequence of my browsing habits, but I keep seeing articles online about some sort of revival of physical media, usually vinyl, CDs and DVDs, but even audio cassettes. However, I don't know the actual data and suspect the articles are hyping a small increase from a low baseline, or possibly misinterpreting/misrepresenting an increase in absolute numbers that hides a declining proportion of sales. For example one of the Taylor Swift albums sold more copies on vinyl in whatever year it was (2021 say) than the top 100 selling vinyl albums in 2011, but likely streamed a gajillion more times than that.

Along the same lines, I read articles decrying the steady "enshittification" of streaming services; content withdrawn or moving to another platform, introduction of ads on free tiers etc. This rings true to me.

Quote from thewatcher

Along the same lines, I read articles decrying the steady "enshittification" of streaming services; content withdrawn or moving to another platform, introduction of ads on free tiers etc. This rings true to me.

Exactly! Owning a physical copy gives you the security of having it whenever you want, including times when the internet is not available.

Quote from thewatcher

I'm 42 and avidly attached to my physical media (I recently set up a VCR 😆). That said, I stream a lot for convenience - mostly while commuting - and I find it excellent for discovering new music, along with the local college radio station. If I find something I like on streaming I'll typically go and buy it then.

It may also be a consequence of my browsing habits, but I keep seeing articles online about some sort of revival of physical media, usually vinyl, CDs and DVDs, but even audio cassettes. However, I don't know the actual data and suspect the articles are hyping a small increase from a low baseline, or possibly misinterpreting/misrepresenting an increase in absolute numbers that hides a declining proportion of sales. For example one of the Taylor Swift albums sold more copies on vinyl in whatever year it was (2021 say) than the top 100 selling vinyl albums in 2011, but likely streamed a gajillion more times than that.

Along the same lines, I read articles decrying the steady "enshittification" of streaming services; content withdrawn or moving to another platform, introduction of ads on free tiers etc. This rings true to me.

This is me as well - I just turned 43, and a couple years ago I got into vinyl. At first for sound quality reasons, but over the two years it has also become for nostalgic reasons-as I listen to all the music my parents did, and NOW I'm listening to it on the FORMAT they did LOL!

As for TV, we went all-streaming about a year ago and are loving it-although it's slowly becoming more and more like cable anyway. But I still have an extensive blu ray collection, as I am a bit picky with the HD visual (with no signal degradation) and surround sound audio quality of my favorite movies-so I will always watch those thru physical media.

But I agree, I feel like in this fast paced world, more and more people are valuing the concept of slowing down, and taking time to listen to and appreciate their music more-and enjoying ways that they can physically connect to their music. For some younger people, they've never experienced that before-so it's understandable how they could find a new and tangible way of enjoying media enjoyable. My kids (middle school age) are just completely fascinated by my record collection and player, and the idea that the music is all stored on that big black disc LOL!

BTW: "enshittification" HAHAHAHAHA!! I'm totally going to use that word LOL!