Why the big Genesis reunion didn't happen after 2005

"Genesis is a strange band... they were privileged but brutalised": Steve Hackett remains "very proud" of his six years with Genesis, but has no regrets about leaving

"I choose to celebrate Genesis’s classic work with a band that relishes it" says Steve Hackett

www.loudersound.com

This is a link to a Daily Telegraph interview which is paywalled, so some of the summary may be taken out of context.. But he's starting to sound like Don Felder, formerly of the Eagles. I don't recall him being this bitter about Genesis before. He makes them sound like the Conservative party. This about the reunion tour:

Genesis is a strange band. They ask you, and then when you say yes they say… surplus to requirements. It’s so competitive.

Quote from thewatcher

I didn't know he had agreed to participate in one of the reunion tours and was given the cold shoulder after. Or maybe that's not what happened? Regardless I picked up on the same fairly direct hostility you did.

I think it's a reference to what became the 07 tour. In 05 the five met (in Glasgow I think) to discuss taking The Lamb on tour. It was felt to be a done deal with the meeting a discussion of logistics etc. But PC's account is that PG opened with "We're here to discuss whether we're doing this" - ie, not when but if!

PC describes how they instantly reverted to their old roles - TB & PG arguing, MR being the gentlemanly moderator, himself being lighthearted trying to defuse the atmosphere, SH off to one side being 'dark' and marginal.

PG concluded that he couldn't (wouldn't?) do it, then left. Shortly after, SH left - sound familiar?! The trio decided to get DS & CT in and do the tour.

I'm not sure if a 4-man + CT option was discussed. It would've focused on 70-77 of course, over which I'm sure many here would salivate. I think the trio didn't want to eliminate post-77, which seemed to mean no place for SH. Not sure if he'd been up for doing post-77 stuff but there's a potentially intriguing tour in some other universe.

TB said he felt very sorry for SH over the outcome of that meeting.

There's some interviews with Tony Banks where he was asked if a quartet reunion was a possibility, each time he clearly denied: Steve is part of the quintet, he is only in if Peter is in too.

I checked the relevant passage in Chapter & Verse. PC says the option of the 4-man line-up was never under consideration. He too says he felt bad for SH over how the discussion turned out.

Banks said that as soon as the Lamb tour idea was evidently not on, they decided to consider a trio tour and that the trio material is what he's most proud of. He also says "It would be strange for Steve to play the later material, I don't think he'd be keen to play I Can't Dance." I don't know if there's any record of the idea of his playing on an all-eras tour ever having been put to him.

A couple of other bits from revisiting this section of the book: PC got the ball rolling on the lead-up to the 5-man meeting. Promoting Archive 1 made him think about a 5-man reunion, and in interviews he'd say he was up for it if the others were, but the main onus would be on PG. Those comments obviously got repeated and they penetrated PG's mind, causing him to say he'd be interested in a Lamb tour. MR and PC immediately thought this sounded good especially as the 75 Lamb tour had been frustrating and never quite worked as it should, so this would be a chance to fix that. Banks was the least interested, but came around to the idea.

Banks said that after the Glasgow meeting (which was in fact Nov 04) PG hadn't ever said he was definitely not going to do the tour, he just never said he would do it! This left them with the notion it still might happen, but would now have to be after the 07 tour which was now being planned. But of course, it didn't. PC said that during 07 rehearsals it was clear the Lamb idea had now "fizzled out". He reiterated that he'd have loved to play drums behind a PG-led Genesis tour.

You can read the whole article free in the link below.

Genesis' Steve Hackett: ‘Phil Collins doesn't deserve what’s happened to him’

(Source: The Daily Telegraph)

Quote from IWishItWouldRainDown

You can read the whole article free in the link below.

Genesis' Steve Hackett: ‘Phil Collins doesn't deserve what’s happened to him’

(Source: The Daily Telegraph)

Thanks for posting that, it gave a softer overall feel than the pull-quotes suggested. It's quite a good piece. I should add, it's not a secure link though.

Two great summaries from Backdrifter and its interesting to read what Steve says, although it is only re-capping what he has said before, that the upbringing of the Charterhouse lads left them reserved to say the least (thankfully they found ways to express themselves through music...). I imagine he was more reserved himself in his twenties and that probably exacerbated the separation between him and them, more than Phil, who seems more upbeat and outgoing. His leaving coincided and probably contributed to, a change in direction for the band, which became such a tight unit that it would be even harder to return, even temporarily. Then there are the logistics of what he would play on from the three man era live, if anything. So, once Peter dropped out of any reunion you would be catering for two audiences, one a small, devoted bunch like us who want the earlier classics and another, stadium size group. Whilst there are crossovers in that particular venn diagram, (again many of us here) it would be a strange set to put together, maybe with Steve in a part one, Darryl in part two and a coming together at the end. I can see why it was easier for the three to fall back on what they knew and enjoyed and certainly Tony Smith would know which way the spreadsheets worked.

Hackett last performed live with Genesis in 1982, but missed more recent reunions including what was billed as their final performances in 2022.

That's the part which made me think Steve was talking about 2022.

Quote from IWishItWouldRainDown

You can read the whole article free in the link below.

Genesis' Steve Hackett: ‘Phil Collins doesn't deserve what’s happened to him’

(Source: The Daily Telegraph)

It's a very good read, thank you for posting.

I can understand if Steve feels some frustration. The Charterhouse Trio had stronger personalities and the glue that comes with growing up together, Phil was a great peacekeeper so found his place, but Steve was much more introverted and more of an outsider, yet at the same time he had a very distinctive sound that coloured the prog years. With these dynamics I can see why the others would view him as a man of his time, almost like a hired hand. I can also understand why Tony would view him as unsuited to play the pop trio material and I doubt Steve would want to do it anyway, although I'm sure he could have taken some pieces to a new level live - e.g. Abacab, Mama, Second Home, The Brazilian.

All that said, it cuts both ways as Daryl might be an outstanding guitarist but I don't enjoy his interpretations of the band's earlier material as much as when Steve was playing. However a reunion tour with Steve playing some parts and Daryl others just wouldn't have worked.

I'm rambling. I guess I'm just saying I can understand why Steve would feel the outsider but I also understand why a reunion involving Steve would have needed Peter as well, The band couldn't have done a four piece reunion focusing on 1976-77. The die-hard fans would have loved it and I'd have been front of the queue, but it wouldn't have been appealing enough to the wider public for it to be commercially worthwhile, and so Steve gets left out.

Big shame though.

Quote from Micklemus

The band couldn't have done a four piece reunion focusing on 1976-77.

It wouldn't have to have focused on those specific years though. He was with them until 77, playing stuff from 70 onwards. That would have been the expected approach had he been in on it, but was never an option for the reasons given.

Sorry, I should have expressed myself more clearly. What I meant was there wouldn’t be enough commercial appeal if they played a SET of the 1976-77 kind. Most of us here would love it but the more casual Genesis listeners would not.

I don't really know how commercially viable a 5-man or 4-man tour would have been in the 2000s and onward. A significant portion of people that filled the arenas and small stadiums were there for the 3-man era hits. You could see/hear/feel the waning attention of many during In the Cage, Ripples, etc.

What could have worked might have been a 5-man or 4-man selection of shows in particular markets, which might draw many from other locales. If they did say London, Paris, Rome, New York, they might have been able to fill larger venues with fans of the older material. I still don't know how profitable it would have been - a lot of tours are losing money until the final shows.

Anyway, I totally understand why the band chose to have a 3-man reunion once the 5-man option didn't materialize. To do a 4-man reunion would have awkwardness in a variety of scenarios. If they focused on the catalogue up to 1977, Phil would have had to sing a lot of songs that he hasn't sung in a long time and may not be that into anymore (never mind how into them Tony and Mike would be). And skipping any 3-man songs would definitely reduce their overall ticket sales. I also can't see getting Steve to play guitar (or alternatively bass) for Duke's Intro, Domino, Invisible Touch, etc. I suppose they could have done something like what The Eagles did for their History of The Eagles tour: first set with earlier songs and earlier personnel and second set with later songs with a different set of personnel. But that would have had Steve sit out for the second set and would have made him feel like second fiddle for the tour.

I'm pretty certain when they got all 5 together, Peter didn't want to commit to a long tour and Phil was also on his I have to stay at home for the kids (even though they pretty muched moved not long after) so you had Peter wanting a one off, Phil not wanting to commit to more than a handful of shows and TS wanting a year long tour no doubt so that it would make enough money etc

It's a real shame, because this would have been a rare occasion that an original line up being all alive and healthy could have done something great, but instead they kinda blew it (especially after Phils drumming issues soon after 07 Tour).

Still..... If Nic were to replace Phil, they could technically do a Lamb Tour still in 2025 / 2027 if PG and rest wanted too.

Quote from choccy

I'm pretty certain when they got all 5 together, Peter didn't want to commit to a long tour and Phil was also on his I have to stay at home for the kids (even though they pretty muched moved not long after) so you had Peter wanting a one off, Phil not wanting to commit to more than a handful of shows and TS wanting a year long tour no doubt so that it would make enough money etc

It's a real shame, because this would have been a rare occasion that an original line up being all alive and healthy could have done something great, but instead they kinda blew it (especially after Phils drumming issues soon after 07 Tour).

Still..... If Nic were to replace Phil, they could technically do a Lamb Tour still in 2025 / 2027 if PG and rest wanted too.

Really? They would play only Gabriel era songs?

Quote from choccy

I'm pretty certain when they got all 5 together, Peter didn't want to commit to a long tour and Phil was also on his I have to stay at home for the kids (even though they pretty muched moved not long after) so you had Peter wanting a one off, Phil not wanting to commit to more than a handful of shows and TS wanting a year long tour no doubt so that it would make enough money etc

No, I'm completely certain it's as the band themselves described, in their own words, in Chapter & Verse (which included PC very clearly being the most enthusiastic about doing it).

Quote

Still..... If Nic were to replace Phil, they could technically do a Lamb Tour still in 2025 / 2027 if PG and rest wanted too.

🤣

Tony and Mike both repeatedly answered to questions on a 5-man lineup reunion: "People seem to forget we could only play songs from the Gabriel era."

How could we all miss this point - who would want to see a Genesis concert without I Can't Dance, Throwing It All Away, Hold On My Heart, etc.?