GENESIS - 40th anniversary of "Three Sides Live"

    Quote from Micklemus

    Me and Sarah Jane is boring (to my ears) and Follow You Follow Me might be a popular song but I don't think it offers anything here (or to most live shows)

    While I disagree with most of what you say about 3SL, especially in comparison to SO, I do largely agree with this ^. While I actually love M&SJ on Abacab - for me, it's a classic - the 3SL version is poor and somewhat clunky. But they needed to bolster the presence of the recent album otherwise it would've been represented by the title track and Dodo. No Reply didn't sound good live and would've been a poor choice; MOTC might've been a possibility I suppose.


    FYFM is ok but underwhelming and as you say, that's characteristic of its live appearances generally. At the recent tour I went to 3 gigs and during the 2nd and 3rd FYFM was the only time the show started to drag a bit. It was also dull on the 07 tour.


    Misunderstanding - I've never minded the song and thought DS added some nice touches to it live but the elongated vocal business near the end is irritating and overdone. (Did that feature during its appearance on the TLD tour?).


    But yeah you're right, they were both big hits and couldn't realistically be left off.

    Abandon all reason

    Like 1

    Bought it and played it to exhaustion, in time I began skipping a couple of songs but I loved the energy of the album. To me it isn't necessarily better or worse than SO, they just are very different, it's more of a mood thing. 3SL was summertime, packed with energy and joie de vivre, SO was more wintertime, intimate and wistful. I think Phil never got enough credit for the kind of singer he became, something that became evident on 3SL.

    Quote from Fabrizio

    Bought it and played it to exhaustion, in time I began skipping a couple of songs but I loved the energy of the album. To me it isn't necessarily better or worse than SO, they just are very different, it's more of a mood thing. 3SL was summertime, packed with energy and joie de vivre, SO was more wintertime, intimate and wistful. I think Phil never got enough credit for the kind of singer he became, something that became evident evident on 3SL.

    So well put. I agree.

    Quote from Fabrizio

    Bought it and played it to exhaustion, in time I began skipping a couple of songs but I loved the energy of the album. To me it isn't necessarily better or worse than SO, they just are very different, it's more of a mood thing. 3SL was summertime, packed with energy and joie de vivre, SO was more wintertime, intimate and wistful. I think Phil never got enough credit for the kind of singer he became, something that became evident on 3SL.

    While I'm not keen on SO this is nicely expressed and fair enough on their being very different albums, which they are. And should be - they serve very different purposes. Also strong agreement on PC's vocal development.

    Abandon all reason

    Don't misunderstand me, I think Me and Sarah Jane is a reasonable track. In the studio. On stage, I think it was let down by Chester's drumming (sorry Chester) which lacked the subtlety and feel that the song needed. Phil is a bit too OTT as well.


    When I saw Genesis at Twickenham in 2007 Follow You Follow Me was touching and brought a tear to my eye. The 3SL version feels like filler to me.


    Misunderstanding - we'll have to agree to differ there! I agree that Daryl helps make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. However, I think Chester (again) lacks subtlety here, the bit at the end is toe curlingly awful and, well, the song is overrated generally. But life would be boring if we all agreed on everything.


    I loved Fabrizio's summation. I can appreciate a good chunk of the band's simpler, more direct stuff (except that DREADFUL album with Stations in the title) and I can also appreciate the evolution of their live sound, particularly the 81 and 82 tours funnily enough, where they totally rocked. Also, against the grain here, I quite like the Abacab album and I think Phil's voice peaked at this time too.. However, the band I fell in love with was the band that went for ambitious arrangements, moods and complexity (but without disappearing up their own backsides like Yes etc) and that's why Seconds Out wins for me. I'm not a 3SL hater, it has some great live tracks and I listened to it only a couple of weeks ago, but Seconds Out is one of the top five that I will always enjoy because, for me, good progressive rock is music which takes you on a journey, and in this respect it beats 3SL hands down.

    Quote from Micklemus

    When I saw Genesis at Twickenham in 2007 Follow You Follow Me was touching and brought a tear to my eye. The 3SL version feels like filler to me.


    Misunderstanding - we'll have to agree to differ there! I agree that Daryl helps make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. However, I think Chester (again) lacks subtlety here, the bit at the end is toe curlingly awful and, well, the song is overrated generally. But life would be boring if we all agreed on everything.

    For years I thought FYFM on 3SL put the SO version to shame, same with Afterglow. I guess I got carried away by Phil's newly found vocal power but in time I came to realize that delivering a song is also about mood and nuances, not necessarily power. The perks of aging, I guess but again, it's a mood thing, I can listen to the two versions equally, depending on the moment.

    About Misunderstanding, one of the songs I started skipping, I agree that it is incredibly overrated, same with Abacab but I understand why the former is always played live.

    Quote from Fabrizio

    For years I thought FYFM on 3SL put the SO version to shame, same with Afterglow. I guess I got carried away by Phil's newly found vocal power but in time I came to realize that delivering a song is also about mood and nuances, not necessarily power. The perks of aging, I guess but again, it's a mood thing, I can listen to the two versions equally, depending on the moment.

    About Misunderstanding, one of the songs I started skipping, I agree that it is incredibly overrated, same with Abacab but I understand why the former is always played live.

    FYFM on Seconds Out???? I get your point though, and I agree. It's the light and shade, power and delicacy that you get from those earlier songs and performances which appeals to me. In the 80s (and evident on 3SL) it was "BAM, we're here, we're good at what we do, take that, and that...and that" whereas in 77 it was more about the range and getting the most atmosphere from each piece. I think much of this was down to Steve Hackett still being in the band. Daryl might be technically more proficient but Steve had atmosphere in spades. Also, Tony was still using the Mellotron, which might have been a nightmare to maintain but the sounds it produced were perfect for classic Genesis and never matched by his synth efforts in later years. And although Hugh Padgham's production, with its very immediate sound, was perfect for the 'newer' numbers on 3SL, David Hentschel captured the feel of the bands 'older' numbers proportionately better on Seconds Out (despite SH being too low in the mix in places). In my view of course.


    I've said enough!

    Quote from Micklemus

    FYFM on Seconds Out???? I get your point though, and I agree. It's the light and shade, power and delicacy that you get from those earlier songs and performances which appeals to me. In the 80s (and evident on 3SL) it was "BAM, we're here, we're good at what we do, take that, and that...and that" whereas in 77 it was more about the range and getting the most atmosphere from each piece. I think much of this was down to Steve Hackett still being in the band. Daryl might be technically more proficient but Steve had atmosphere in spades. Also, Tony was still using the Mellotron, which might have been a nightmare to maintain but the sounds it produced were perfect for classic Genesis and never matched by his synth efforts in later years. And although Hugh Padgham's production, with its very immediate sound, was perfect for the 'newer' numbers on 3SL, David Hentschel captured the feel of the bands 'older' numbers proportionately better on Seconds Out (despite SH being too low in the mix in places). In my view of course.


    I've said enough!

    It's actually odd, if I compare the tracks list on the two albums there is no match, SO has everything that hooked me up on Genesis and made them my favorite band, everything except Peter which is no minor detail, Phil as a singer does a fine, proficient job on some of Peter's songs, less so on others imo.

    On 3SL he's another singer altogether and although it is true that he took some licenses, because of the self-confidence he had gained, his delivery of In the cage, for instance, let me in awe.

    That album made my summer and for a brief moment I put SO aside. 3SL was my summer flirt but SO is my romantic love affair, 2 very different things. I have a soft spot for the 1980 Lyceum Theatre, I saw it on YouTube and I think it's the right blend between the early days magic and the new energy creeping in. Phil is already a good singer, Daryl and particularly Chester seem to blend in better and Duke was a great album to take on the road. About FYFM on SO, my bad, I meant the studio version.

    3SL was my first Genesis album and hooked me on the band, especially the Abacab/Duke era... and that wild song about a cage ;) This was in my walkman era, and the original cassette I had bit the dust a long time ago. "I don't recall" listening to side 4 all that much other than Paperlate, which was a popular radio staple at the time. It was nice to get the "4th SL" when I bought it on CD many years later. Does anyone have a CD version where the tracking isn't all screwed up on "side 4"?

    Quote from Backdrifter

    ...While I actually love M&SJ on Abacab - for me, it's a classic - the 3SL version is poor and somewhat clunky.

    M&SJ is one of my all-time favorite Genesis songs. Odd lyrics, but the multiple layers of keyboard parts and through-composed construction always takes me on a satisfying musical journey. Early 1980s keyboard technology wouldn't let Tony reproduce all those layers live on stage, so I agree that the live recording lacks much of the impact of the studio version.

    Quote from choccy

    it's still bizzar that because they released this live album, they chose to ignore Mama & Invisible Touch live albums.


    I never understood the logic, that these two eras were dismissed & still are.


    I'm certain live albums especially of IT in 1988 would have been huge seller for them, to help bridge a 5 year gap between albums

    They tended to release a live album after three or four studio albums had been released.


    Genesis Live, while not originally planned by the band, came after Trespass, Nursery Cryme and Selling England (not counting FGTR)


    Seconds Out then came after Selling England, The Lamb, Trick and Wind


    3SL was after ATTW3, Duke and Abacab


    TWWW (both volumes) may have been a full decade later but was after only three albums - "Mama", Invisible Touch and WCD.


    Remember in those days the intention wasn't to present something akin to attending a full live concert from an individual tour. It was to present their favourite songs performed live, as to distinguish them from the studio version and give everyone a chance to hear what certain songs sounded like live.


    They *could* have put one out between Invisible Touch and We Can't Dance but it would have seemed a bit like overload at the time.


    Additionally, the 80s was the era of home video becoming "a thing". We got videos of the 80s tours. Genesis and their management probably didn't think that it was right to put out a live album too. Remember that it wasn't an easy task....say they'd done it in 1988....that would still have meant mastering for CD, vinyl and cassette...selecting songs for what would have likely been a double album so 80-95 minutes or so. Trying not to use songs already released on previous live albums so it would have heavily relied on material from just Mama and Invisible Touch....because people didn't want yet another version of Carpet Crawlers or Los Endos.


    things are very different today when they could conceivably master a live recording for a digital stream/download and be done with it. And today we will lap up the nth version of IKWIL or Invisible Touch.

    I discovered Genesis with the release of the Abacab album, and Three Sides Live was their first album i bought on release day after having anxiously waited for it to be out in the shops.

    It still remains my favourite live Genesis album.

    I bought the european edition and in that pre-internet days i didn't know the 1980 songs were Duke b-sides, just as i didn't know the Abacab outtakes had been already released as an EP in the UK the month before. That european studio 4th side really caught my attention. It was so good.

    Now, 40 years later, i still listen to Three Sides Live from time to time. I always put on an early W. Germany cd edition (fatbox) which has great dynamics and it reproduces the sound just like i remember it on my old 2LP italian pressing.

    I avoid the 2008 remix. Too much compression.

    I just wish they originally included the Dance On A Volcano/Los Endos medley, which fortunately is available on various King Biscuit Flower Hour / Westwood One radio shows. It's the last time they performed that medley on tour and the Nassau Coliseum performance (Three Sides Live outtake) is outstanding.

    I love most of it. But then I'm biased, because I'm on a lot of it! Apparently much of it was recorded 23/12/82 at the NEC, which was my first Genesis gig.


    I can live without the slightly annoying vocals on Misunderstanding, but the rest still gets a lot of play here.


    I'm very glad MASJ is on it, as that's probably my favourite Abacab track.

    I played this album to death for months on end when it was first released. Phil’s was at his peak vocally during this period and it really shines through on 3SL. And to me the production is much sharper on 3SL as compared to Seconds Out.

    I really like 3SL, it was one of the earlier things I got when I was delving into their back catalog as a teen post WCD. I loved the big stage shot when you open the gatefold (I had it on vinyl), and not knowing the band that well *and* being pre-internet when you couldn't find everything out instantly, there was something very mysterious - and therefore magical - about the non-live 4th side. You Might Recall and Evidence of Autumn remain top favorites to this day. As for the live stuff, there was a definite bristling energy they had at that point and I'm a fan of the setlist. 3SL a great document of the time.

    Quote from Mozo

    I love most of it. But then I'm biased, because I'm on a lot of it! Apparently much of it was recorded 23/12/82 at the NEC, which was my first Genesis gig.


    I can live without the slightly annoying vocals on Misunderstanding, but the rest still gets a lot of play here.


    I'm very glad MASJ is on it, as that's probably my favourite Abacab track.


    Whoops. Just noticed a typo in my original post. It was 23/12/81, not 82.


    Other people have mentioned that blurry pink photo, presumably from Afterglow, on the inside of the gatefold. When the album came out I remember telling people how much l loved that picture, and friends telling me "what's to like? It's just a blur...".


    Yeah? Well, wait until you see some varilites!

    Quote from Mozo

    Whoops. Just noticed a typo in my original post. It was 23/12/81, not 82.


    Other people have mentioned that blurry pink photo, presumably from Afterglow, on the inside of the gatefold. When the album came out I remember telling people how much l loved that picture, and friends telling me "what's to like? It's just a blur...".


    Yeah? Well, wait until you see some varilites!

    What's also notable is that the inner photo is printed the wrong way round. Seems a repeated error with the band albums: see also the live photo on the rear of the Italian SEBTP. (Error repeated by Rhino on one of their more recent US vinyl reissues.)

    Quote from Phil Morris

    What's also notable is that the inner photo is printed the wrong way round. Seems a repeated error with the band albums: see also the live photo on the rear of the Italian SEBTP. (Error repeated by Rhino on one of their more recent US vinyl reissues.)

    Another thing I didn't knows. I like those detals. Thanks!

    I feel there are SO many typos, typesetting errors and just plain wrong facts on Genesis merchandise, that it MUST be some kind way of communicating with us.


    In the same way that the picture of the Beatles walking across Abbey Road was stone cold proof that Paul was dead (obviously), I can only assume Genesis are dropping hints here and there.


    My theory is that in 1974 Bill Bruford retired, Phil Collins had reconstructive surgery to look like Bruford so he could replace him in King Crimson, and Phil was replaced in Genesis by the dummer from Showaddywaddy (who had reconstructive surgery, obviously).


    I mean, when you look at the clues, it's all obvious.