I believe the 3 songs on the EP were recorded during the Wind & Wuthering sessions, but none of them made the cut for the album. But they did appear as the Spot The Pigeon EP. I can remember buying this when it got released in 1977. I didn't like the first two songs at all, and they were rightly left off the album. But the final song, Inside And Out, is a good one. And it wouldn't have been out of place if it did appear on the album.
However, the album is 51 minutes long. And that is very long for a single album back in those days. So there was no room unless another song was left off. I would take it instead of Wot Gorilla, but that would mean extending the album by another 3 minutes. And maybe that would be too much. So that means looking at the other songs, Mouses Night, I would maybe consider, but absolutely none of the others.
Spot The Pigeon EP
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i enjoy match of the day...as always reminds me of going to football matches in the 70's and is very tongue in cheek
Inside and out...good track and good enough to make the tour
Spot the Pigeon is probably one of my least played songs...say no more 😔
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Obviously they've since been very down on MOTD but it's ok, nothing special but not too bad and worked well as the lead song ie the one that got airplay. I&O is one of their best songs and is certainly up there in my personal Genesis top 10.
I've often got the sense I'm in a minority on this board in liking Pigeons. Again, not up there among the greats of course but for me a perfectly good catchy song and I'm amused by Banks's intent to try writing a song with "only one note in". I like the slightly bizarre and somewhat obsessive lyric. All 3 of the songs were rather different from their usual output of the time and I always wanted them to take a few more right-angled turns so I have a lot of affection for this EP.
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Being in the U.S., I didn't know for a long time that "Inside & Out" was from an EP. I originally knew of it -- and sought it out -- only as a non-LP B-side by Genesis (and the first such Genesis B-side that I'd heard of). In the U.S. it was the B-side of "Follow You Follow Me". To this day I&O is one of my favorite Genesis songs.
I like "Match" and "Pigeons," but I agree that they wouldn't fit the mood of WIND & WUTHERING at all.
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I like "Match" and "Pigeons," but I agree that they wouldn't fit the mood of WIND & WUTHERING at all.
Interesting. I think their jarringly different feel would be a good reason to include them.
Gorilla has b-side stamped all over it and could easily have made way for one of the shorter songs, preferably Pigeons. On an album replete with lyrics that are variously twee (Mouse, Mar), soppy (Own) and overcooked (Vine) it would've been a nice bold move to have a straightforward untwiddly track kicking off with "Who put 50 tons of shit on the Foreign Office roof".
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I like all the songs on W&W, but if I was going to make one of my favourite albums even stronger, I would have inserted Inside & Out in place of Your Own Special Way.
Both are between 6 and 7 minutes long so it would have been doable based on limitations of album lengths at that time.
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I like all three songs, though I think that because of the running time limitations they chose the right songs to include and exclude from Wind and Wuthering.
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Makes me wonder if, had the album been released in the CD age, if any of those EP tracks would have been included.
Personally, I like putting everything that was recorded during the album sessions onto the record as it gives a broader impression of where the artist was at the time (even if it means including crap like The Day The Light Went Out on And Then There Were Three!). So my fan-edit of W&W includes the EP tracks and it doesn't alter the mood at all. Yes, Match Of The Day and Pigeons are short and somewhat throwaway in terms of the subject matter but the balance is redressed by Inside And Out which is altogether longer and just about the most serous subject the band had written about at the time.
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I like all three songs. I agree Match of the Day and Pigeons are a bit slight, but Genesis has always done humorous and lighter songs that are usually on the short side. They do provide a nice contrast to the more challenging epics. The Lamb benefits from the shift in tone provided by Counting Out Time and Supernatural Anaesthetist. Selling England similarly does well with IKWIL positioned between two heavier and longer songs.
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Makes me wonder if, had the album been released in the CD age, if any of those EP tracks would have been included.
Personally, I like putting everything that was recorded during the album sessions onto the record as it gives a broader impression of where the artist was at the time (even if it means including crap like The Day The Light Went Out on And Then There Were Three!). So my fan-edit of W&W includes the EP tracks and it doesn't alter the mood at all. Yes, Match Of The Day and Pigeons are short and somewhat throwaway in terms of the subject matter but the balance is redressed by Inside And Out which is altogether longer and just about the most serous subject the band had written about at the time.
Not for me. I think a lot of albums are weaker for being longer and having not so good tracks on them . They get boring. I don't think any of STP songs are good enough for W&W. Its pretty well perfect as it is.
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I don't think any of STP songs are good enough for W&W. Its pretty well perfect as it is.
Personally I rate I&O way, way higher than anything on W&W. But then I only really like Blood and Afterglow.
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Personally I rate I&O way, way higher than anything on W&W. But then I only really like Blood and Afterglow.
That surprises me. Other than Trick it's my favourite album of all time. I&O is ok though for me not up to their best. I prefer the other two songs simply for their quirkiness. The second half of I&O reminds me of Tommy era Who. Nothing wrong with that but it just doesn't match up to Genesis classic.
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I've often got the sense I'm in a minority on this board in liking Pigeons. Again, not up there among the greats of course but for me a perfectly good catchy song and I'm amused by Banks's intent to try writing a song with "only one note in". I like the slightly bizarre and somewhat obsessive lyric. All 3 of the songs were rather different from their usual output of the time and I always wanted them to take a few more right-angled turns so I have a lot of affection for this EP.
I also like Pigeons a lot. It gained quality when remixed in 2006/7
Inside And Out was a real treat during one of the recent Hackett tours...
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Inside And Out was a real treat during one of the recent Hackett tours...
Others here share that view but sadly I thought they killed the song off. The first section was great but the instrumental I found terrible. It felt too 'light' and seemed to drain all the substance of the original. The inclusion of a shrill tootling flute was a ludicrous idea and made the instrumental sound silly and fluffy.
It was a major crashing disappointment for me as it was the track I'd most been looking forward to and I was left crestfallen. It was a contributing factor to my deciding to not bother with any further Hackett Genesis Recycled shows.
That said, I find myself wondering if there will ever be any gigs by anyone ever again!
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I also like Pigeons a lot. It gained quality when remixed in 2006/7
Yes, there's a nice effect on Phil's voice that reminds me of The Beatles, doubtless the intent.
Inside And Out was a real treat during one of the recent Hackett tours...
Pft, not with Dany La Rue on vocals.
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Others here share that view but sadly I thought they killed the song off. The first section was great but the instrumental I found terrible. It felt too 'light' and seemed to drain all the substance of the original. The inclusion of a shrill tootling flute was a ludicrous idea and made the instrumental sound silly and fluffy.
It was a major crashing disappointment for me as it was the track I'd most been looking forward to and I was left crestfallen. It was a contributing factor to my deciding to not bother with any further Hackett Genesis Recycled shows.
That said, I find myself wondering if there will ever be any gigs by anyone ever again!
Sadly, I have to agree, an opportunity missed.
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Others here share that view but sadly I thought they killed the song off. The first section was great but the instrumental I found terrible. It felt too 'light' and seemed to drain all the substance of the original. The inclusion of a shrill tootling flute was a ludicrous idea and made the instrumental sound silly and fluffy.
It was a major crashing disappointment for me as it was the track I'd most been looking forward to and I was left crestfallen. It was a contributing factor to my deciding to not bother with any further Hackett Genesis Recycled shows.
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To be honest, I haven't heard a live version, even by Genesis, that matched the power of the original studio version.
It's one of those songs that benefits, I think, from layers of different guitars and other instruments creating a full or unique sound.
Even though I still enjoy the recordings of Genesis performing it live, there are elements in that second half that seem a bit glossed over.
