GENESIS - UK/Ireland Tour 2020 rescheduled for FALL 2021

  • I am actually “afraid” they might do this keg of the tour, but EU citizens won’t come due to restrictions in connection with the delta variant (quarantine regulations etc). Or in other words, it could happen that travel won’t be that easy then but the shows will go ahead as planned. Not the likeliest of all predictions, but if that happens, I really would be quite disappointed. I know a lot of fans from Germany who want to see a UK show.

  • Thank you. You just saved me half an hour's typing!

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • Well I think we know the answer to that: no.


    The notion of questioning is vital, it's at the very root of our existence, it's essentially what science is. Then it becomes a matter of how you question, on what basis, and what you do with the answers. At that point, some of the time any alleged intelligence goes out of the window. We're seeing a dispiriting amount of that in relation to covid.

    Exactly. Questioning things with a degree of intelligence might very well be, but just questioning because some other people are, is just being a puppet.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • I am actually “afraid” they might do this keg of the tour, but EU citizens won’t come due to restrictions in connection with the delta variant (quarantine regulations etc). Or in other words, it could happen that travel won’t be that easy then but the shows will go ahead as planned. Not the likeliest of all predictions, but if that happens, I really would be quite disappointed. I know a lot of fans from Germany who want to see a UK show.

    I think it could be the likeliest of predictions. Whilst I'm no fan of Boris Johnson I believe him that we will open up completely in July in the UK. I don't think this is the correct thing to do. We should still have testing or proof of vaccination for large events. But in the governments mind they are only worried about how many people are showing up at the hospital. They don't want scenes like we see in India of people dying outside the hospital waiting to get in. Not good for re-election So I believe this tour will take place. As for people coming from the EU I expect it will depend on infection rates in each country. You have 1500 cases a day in Germany right now so they are managing to keep it quite low at the moment.

  • Well I think we know the answer to that: no.


    The notion of questioning is vital, it's at the very root of our existence, it's essentially what science is. Then it becomes a matter of how you question, on what basis, and what you do with the answers. At that point, some of the time any alleged intelligence goes out of the window. We're seeing a dispiriting amount of that in relation to covid.

    I think I created a minor tangle here. I was trying to be cute by showing my intelligence by questioning his or her assertion that questioning everything was a sign of intelligence. Or something like that.


    I completely agree with what you said. Questioning is what science is. I think this concept has been misappropriated though - most prominently by Trump - to mean that a random individual who has zero knowledge or expertise in a field can decide they don't like the opinion/theory/knowledge of someone has expertise, and by the mere fact of 'questioning' said opinion, feel like they are legitimately participating in the scientific process somehow because that's what science is. It's a catch 22 for those like yourself and myself who are open to anything being questioned as long as the basis of said questioning is valid somehow. Life saving, foundational discoveries have been made in this way. Truthfully, anyone can ask any question about anything that legitimately occurs to them, an expert can be blinded and not see the obvious.


    Unfortunately, "they" don't give a shit about validity. As long as the old process of knowledge-communication is disrupted and their target audience comes away from any news article about the topic raging about Bill Gates, 5G, Covid, Soros, or the minotaur itself: COVID-5G. (That's the version where Bill Gates has fused with George Soros, and they have miniaturized themselves and replicated billions of copies of the resultant virion and infect every cell of every living thing on earth. The head of the DUP is the last remaining human too toxic to be infected by this extinction-threatening virus and is consequently the last remaining hope for humankind. Unfortunately his response is "NO" and we are done for).


    I think we need some baseline level of trust in experts among the population, otherwise in the example of a pandemic or a climate catastrophe, how can we communicate knowledge to people? I don't know the right answer here.

  • I think the right answer for those who question the advice of experts is to move to Brazil, where there are no restrictions. ;)

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • But David Hasselhoff said he found freedom by being vaccinated. All part of a ridiculous campaign in Germany. Hopefully he will be a support act for Genesis on the upcoming tour. I can already imagine a duet with Phil. This is a land of confusion.

    No!

  • Smart motorways are, indeed, a dumb idea. But they are purely a political decision, no one forced it on anyone. A virus however, doesn't follow a political agenda, it follows biology.


    So, given your "clear" expertise on the subject, explain Brazil, and how no action at all has been better or worse than your (factually inaccurate in places) assessment of places that have dealt with the pandemic.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • Indeed. As per your list, many of the things that the UK government have got wrong in the pandemic were done because they were following whatever was “the science” & the SAGE experts’ opinion at that particular time. “The science” & opinion then changed & the government changed the rules accordingly.


    But since the start of the pandemic any questioning, of “the science” has been decried as misinformation. Respected scientists expressing valid concerns about lockdown’s effects on missed cancer treatments, heart attacks, strokes etc were attacked in the press or silenced e.g. by having social media accounts suspended. Yes the obvious loons who think Bill Gates is injecting people with microchips & suchlike should be ignored, but the general groupthink condemnation of any sort of questioning, however reasonable or well-informed it may be, is just as worrying.

  • The fascinating thing about sciences and scientists is ... they can be wrong, as they always have to deal with what's going on during a specific time / moment. And there's a difference between an assumption and evidence. We have learned a lot about this virus during the last 18 months. Measures taken are political decisions, which are hopefully based on scientific evidence. How effective some measures are can always be discussed, but it's pretty obvious that gathering in rooms does not help fight a pandemic. And this brings any health system down.

    It's also quite obvious that the UK government is not the best example for a good crisis management.


    Having said that, and coming back to topic with that, I am pretty shocked that the UK government will allow 60,000 people in a stadium for the EURO finale. The virus and its delta-variant now keeps spreading among younger people in the UK. My hope for Genesis shows this fall in the UK is pretty much gone.

  • My social media footprint, admittedly never very expansive anyway, has narrowed to this site and YouTube because I grew so weary of the politicization of seemingly every conversation. While I realize this is a single thread on this site I would like to express my sincere wish that we just put the more politicized fragments of the thread to rest. Less lecturing on the politics of pandemics and more listening to each other’s opinions on the world’s best band sounds splendid to me.

  • My social media footprint, admittedly never very expansive anyway, has narrowed to this site and YouTube because I grew so weary of the politicization of seemingly every conversation. While I realize this is a single thread on this site I would like to express my sincere wish that we just put the more politicized fragments of the thread to rest. Less lecturing on the politics of pandemics and more listening to each other’s opinions on the world’s best band sounds splendid to me.

    Hear! Hear!

  • The fascinating thing about sciences and scientists is ... they can be wrong, as they always have to deal with what's going on during a specific time / moment. And there's a difference between an assumption and evidence. We have learned a lot about this virus during the last 18 months. Measures taken are political decisions, which are hopefully based on scientific evidence. How effective some measures are can always be discussed, but it's pretty obvious that gathering in rooms does not help fight a pandemic. And this brings any health system down.

    It's also quite obvious that the UK government is not the best example for a good crisis management.


    Having said that, and coming back to topic with that, I am pretty shocked that the UK government will allow 60,000 people in a stadium for the EURO finale. The virus and its delta-variant now keeps spreading among younger people in the UK. My hope for Genesis shows this fall in the UK is pretty much gone.

    Hi Christian. Yes, that’s a pity : they will be forced to postpone again the UK tour. For the american leg of the tour, there’s actually no specific problems.

  • Measures taken are political decisions, which are hopefully based on scientific evidence.

    Hopefully! But they are not, I guess. Everyday now there is more evidence that most measures taken are based on nothing but false (or better: irrelevant) numbers.

    Anyway, as the US is opening up everything to full capacity as many European countries do - why not UK, too? Germany will - as always - be the last in line.

    No!

  • Hopefully! But they are not, I guess. Everyday now there is more evidence that most measures taken are based on nothing but false (or better: irrelevant) numbers.

    Anyway, as the US is opening up everything to full capacity as many European countries do - why not UK, too? Germany will - as always - be the last in line.

    Still trotting out the party line, eh? Coronavirus rallies: Germany′s growing anti-lockdown movement | Germany| News and in-depth reporting from Berlin and beyond | DW | 06.08.2020


    DW (Deutsche Welle) is Germany's equivalent to the BBC World Service, and has a similar, highly regarded, high standard of reporting. And as seen in this article, they have had a reporter harangued by the protesters, just like the BBC did last week I believe, at an anti-lockdown rally.


    I commented on Brazil the other day, in reply to another misguided commenter, and was "told" :rolleyes: it was irrelevant to the issue. Odd! The country whose leadership has done nothing about the pandemic now has the biggest death rate currently ravaging the country, having failed to tackle this "non-existent" virus.


    Isn't it ironic that information technology has enabled the misinformers and the misinformed more than anyone.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • 16,000 new cases in the UK yesterday. If the tour goes ahead in the UK, I will surely be without fans from outside the UK. Can't see this happening now (travelling etc), but on the other hand, there are everal weeks left.

    some are wise ... and some otherwise

  • Fuuny! You have scandals, I have diversions. :/


    Still, at least we agree on something: Not wasting time on each other.

    Ian


    Works with chess - Not with life

  • Hear! Hear!

    Hey LL. Are you in PA? I thought you may have mentioned PA in one of your posts. The reason I’m bringing it up is to ask you if you’ve ever seen the Genesis cover bands that play the Keswick Theater just outside Philly? In addition to the renowned cover band the Musical Box I’ve seen the cover band The Genesis Show several times. They cover the 1976-1982 era and put on a helluva show. I’m proud to say that I’ve converted my girlfriend into a hardcore Genesis freak. We are seeing the MB in November a week after we see Genesis in Washington, DC (we live on the lower eastern shore of MD) and have tix for TGS as well, though that show is still being rescheduled. Long story short if you haven’t seen those bands (especially the Genesis Show) I highly recommend checking them out!

  • Hey LL. Are you in PA? I thought you may have mentioned PA in one of your posts. The reason I’m bringing it up is to ask you if you’ve ever seen the Genesis cover bands that play the Keswick Theater just outside Philly? In addition to the renowned cover band the Musical Box I’ve seen the cover band The Genesis Show several times. They cover the 1976-1982 era and put on a helluva show. I’m proud to say that I’ve converted my girlfriend into a hardcore Genesis freak. We are seeing the MB in November a week after we see Genesis in Washington, DC (we live on the lower eastern shore of MD) and have tix for TGS as well, though that show is still being rescheduled. Long story short if you haven’t seen those bands (especially the Genesis Show) I highly recommend checking them out!

    Hi! Yes I’m from outside of Philadelphia. I can honestly say that I’ve never seen a Genesis cover band, but would love too! I was looking for when the Musical Box may be playing again, that’s good to know. I’ll have to check them out. I’ve heard that they are top notch!