25 years ago today, the Genesis boxset Archive 1967-75 was released.
A short story abou the making of this set plus a review is available here
Genesis News Com [it]: Genesis - Archive 1967-1975 - 4CD box review (genesis-news.com)
What do you think about the set today?
Genesis News Com [it]: Genesis - Archive 1967-1975 - 4CD box review (genesis-news.com)
As flawed as this release was, I still enjoyed it at the time. It was fascinating to hear The Lamb and other stuff live with a 90s Gabriel on vocals. I could at least imagine what a reunion might have sounded like then.
Thoughts upon reading the review...
Photos: There are none of John Mayhew, and those of Chris Stewart (one) and John Silver (several) don't have any indication of who they are.
Booklet: I haven't looked at it all that much (still haven't read through it all), but the pages are all falling out in my copy.
"Then there is a list of all the tracks on the four CDs and their respective credits. Here (and elsewhere) the reader notices a couple of mistakes."
How about the drums on "Hey!" not being credited? Logically, they're probably played by Chris Stewart, but it would be nice to have confirmation. Assuming it is him, he's been denied what would have been his only performance credit on the set.
I think it's a great boxset! I bought it a few years ago on eBay. I liked the full Lamb concert, and I really didn't notice which parts were re-recorded by Peter and Steve.
It would be nice to have the set remastered!
In an earlier thread (here) I listed a few complaints that I had about this set (including the one about "Hey!" that I brought up again above). However, I've since backed off somewhat from one of them: the ending of the live "Moonlit Knight" being edited out. I got to hear the unedited version recently, and that ending sounded terrible!
Thoughts upon reading the review...
Booklet: I haven't looked at it all that much (still haven't read through it all), but the pages are all falling out in my copy.
Same here, it started soon after I got it - really poor binding.
I've since backed off somewhat from one of them: the ending of the live "Moonlit Knight" being edited out. I got to hear the unedited version recently, and that ending sounded terrible!
Interesting! What was the source?
Interesting! What was the source?
This was the version from "Live at the Rainbow" (in the "Genesis Live 1973-2007" set), which I found on YouTube. If I understand correctly, "Rainbow" includes some of the same live recordings as ARCHIVE.
Ok I'm in existential shock now. I can't believe this was 25 years ago. I might not have picked it up till a year or two later though I guess.
I loved it at the time. I hadn't heard Twilight Alehouse, Happy the Man, Shepherd or Pacidy before and felt it was worth it just for those wonderful tracks. I remember being a bit disappointed with the early demo tracks - I think I was hoping for something like FGTR, but maybe rawer and more interesting. Patricia is absolutely wonderful though.
Don't think I've listened to the live Lamb more than a couple of times - never my favourite tour, apart from the various strange Waiting Room improvisations
Some thoughts about the actual music on the set:
I really don't have much need for a live TLLDOB, and don't consider it as adding significantly to what's already heard on the original album. For me the main features of interest are (1) the full version of "The Waiting Room" that was edited down for the "Evil Jam" B-side; and (2) the odd little bit added to the end of "Anaesthetist."
The live tracks on disc 3 don't really light my fire either, especially the version of "I Know What I Like" (which I didn't listen to at all for a long time). Maybe the full "Rainbow" concert should have just been released separately to begin with, instead of us just getting parts of it here. The BBC version of "Stagnation" could have easily been replaced with some other, more interesting BBC session track (like an earlier, different version of the same song).
The studio tracks at the end of disc 3 are, to me, the most essential tracks, long overdue for CD release. I don't even mind that the beginning of "Twilight" is different than on the actual single.
The Phillips-era stuff on disc 4 is mainly of historical interest, but there are some gems. "Shepherd" is haunting and timeless, and Tony's vocal works well. "Let Us Now Make Love," in spite of falling a little short of its potential (there are other rhymes for "now" besides "brow," you know) has actually brought tears to my eyes at times. "Build Me a Mountain" is a great, twisted rocker (in spite of the out-of-tune guitar and a couple of weak lines of lyrics). The really early demos aren't very competent, but they're fascinating and have something of that odd "what alternate reality did this come from?" quality that I hear in FGTR.
CD 4 of this set was something I had some input in, so although my promised credit never materialised, at least I can say I'm responsible for finding tracks that ended up on a Genesis release.
In The Wilderness and Build Me A Mountain on the fourth CD were sourced from the tapes we found in Ant's attic in the summer of 1995. From those tapes we also supplied the version of Patricia which was superior quality version to the copy that Tony Banks has. I subsequently found the master for the version of Image Blown Out (track 8).
As I subsequently got to hear the planned fourth CD prior to release, I spotted that the versions of Going Out To Get You and Dusk from Tony Banks' copy of the tape were in mono. Thanks to a contact I had, the versions of Going Out To Get You and Dusk appear on the final release in stereo. I also supplied the copy of the 1969 East Grinstead Courier article which is included in the book.
Sadly some tapes - including the 1969 demo of The Movement (or at least part of it) and the 1970 demo of Looking For Someone recorded for the Moody Blues label Threshold Records - could not be located for inclusion and as far as I know still remain elusive.
Sadly some tapes - including the 1969 demo of The Movement (or at least part of it) and the 1970 demo of Looking For Someone recorded for the Moody Blues label Threshold Records - could not be located for inclusion and as far as I know still remain elusive.
Threshold Records ended up being a division of Decca after 1976, and Decca in turn went under, and passed through hands until ending up in Universal's empire. As you may recall, they had a huge fire at their tape storage facility circa 2008, so I wouldn't be surprised if they were lost in that fire. Luckily, the Moodies albums were all at the studio they use in Italy, being remastered by Justin Hayward and Albert Parodi, so they have survived, as witnessed by subsequent releases of remixes of their 1st, 2nd and 4th classic line up albums.
There were also recordings of the first attempts of King Crimson, but they seem to have survived as Fripp had probably negotiated access to them for deluxe editions of ITCOTCK.
Incidentally, I have the 67-75 box set, complete with intact book, and I'm considering selling it, so if anyone is after a copy........
Time flies. Twenty-five years? It doesn't seem that long ago that it was released.
In all that time, I've listened to the live Lamb set perhaps two or three times (Id rather listen to the studio release or any one of a number of decent-sounding recordings from that tour).
The real prize for me was disc 4. The tracks on there were all new to me.Even though some of them pre-date FGTR, they always sounded to me like the missing link between the first album and Trespass. I've played that disc many times over the years.
The studio tracks at the end of disc 3 are, to me, the most essential tracks, long overdue for CD release.
I agree. Up until I bought the Archives box set, I don't believe I had even heard the studio versions of Happy The Man and Twilight Alehouse.
I really liked it when I bought it and I still like it.
I never felt disappointed by the overdubs and other things, I accepted it for what it is, simple as that.
The live recording of the Lamb I think still retains its atmosphere and remains a pleasant experience. The two remaining CDs are very interesting (specially #3) and I appreciate the selection (perhaps I miss a little not having the Cinema Show of the tracks from Rainbow '73 there)
Nowadays it is surprising that after all these years it has become a somewhat obscure object for some fans and somewhat expensive.
I don't believe I had even heard the studio versions of Happy The Man and Twilight Alehouse.
I, too, am a bit thrown by these. I have Happy The Man on the Charisma compilation One More Chance and when I heard the song on Archive 1967-1975 I heard harmony vocals on the intro that were omitted on the compilation version. Is the mix on the CD the same one as found on the (very hard to find) 7" single?
I don't even mind that the beginning of "Twilight" is different than on the actual single.
I have the flexi, the I Know What I Like single and the box set. I hadn't noticed any difference when I heard the box set but I'm going to have to go back and listen to all three now.
I’m really glad I bought this when it came out. I wish others could have the same opportunity
It seems that we might all want to get a copy of this one: https://www.discogs.com/releas…sma-Label-5th-Anniversary .
That’s a nice collection, good one for those who want the single version of Watcher as well
The overdubs in the live version of "The Lamb" are regrettable. I would have preferred a complete re-recording of the album with a more modern production than this pseudo-live. It's all the more regrettable as there are some excellent bootlegs (including soundboards). A box set of little interest (IMO)...
The overdubs in the live version of "The Lamb" are regrettable. I would have preferred a complete re-recording of the album with a more modern production than this pseudo-live. It's all the more regrettable as there are some excellent bootlegs (including soundboards). A box set of little interest (IMO)...
At the time the first box set originally came out it was a real revelation. Bootlegs of the Lamb tour were few and far between and at least for me it was the first opportunity to hear anything from that tour.
I don't have any problems with the idea of the new vocals generally but I do think Peter at the time wanted too much of the re-recorded vocals to be used. Based on how the 2008 box sets used less of the 1995 vocals I guess his stance softened a bit.
