Absolute Peak of Genesis?

I think anyone's view on this depends on your age and when you first saw them. I was lucky enough to see them many times on the Duke tour and I have fantastic memories of each of these shows. Phil was certainly highly skilled at commanding the audience by then and the setlist was very strong. I also think the smaller nature of the venues added so much to the quality of their performance. My first show on the tour was at Guildford Civic Hall (about 20mins from my home then...) and the venue was so intimate. I have no idea of the exact capacity then but it cannot have been much over a thousand. It was a warm up concert but it was still so special. When I saw them at much larger venues in the future some of the magic was inevitably reduced. Anyway a great question but hard to answer.

I'm a Prog fan, so their earlier stuff influences me the most. Selling England By the Pound is regarded as their best album Genesis has done by fans all over the globe.

Quote from Liquid Len

What would you consider the absolute peak of Genesis, artistically speaking? Thinking in terms of songwriting, but also powerhouse live performances. Recently listening to Duke and watching some of the concerts from the Duke tour, I would say the spring of 1980 was their zenith. Your thoughts?

I can't be as specific as you but I agree performance wise I think 80-83 they were at the peak of their powers. Composition wise I think they had different peaks and troughs. 77-78 was a bit of a low point, 74-76 and 80-81 were high points. So to combine performance and composition I do think the Duke and Abacab albums and tours were it.

The Lamb is their artistic high point for me, but with a strong build-up to it from Selling, NC and parts of Foxtrot. Duke and Abacab are also strong, showing them really hitting their stride as a trio. 80-84 was a peak for their live work. They were still great on stage after that, but never as great.

That’s a great question and very hard to answer. In terms of studio work I’d go for the spell that produced Selling, The Lamb and Trick. Here you have a band so full of composers and arrangers at the peak of their powers in a particular style that they were straining to stay together and so one had to go. But the collective efforts produced sublime music in that prog style that never lost its humour, drama, sense of melody and purpose. For live work, Daryl and Chester brought with them an edge that complimented the improvements in technology and available resources to produce a stunning live show. So that early 80s period is probably the peak for live stuff. I was thinking recently that in the 1979-81 period when I discovered the Genesis family of music they managed to turn out Duke, A Curious Feeling, Smallcreep’s Day, PG3, Face Value and Spectral Mornings, Ant also produced Sides, Back to the Pavillion and 1984. That’s a lot of very good music to produce in the period between the studio and live peaks I’ve highlighted. What a band!

Quote from Liquid Len

Totally. I mean the London Lyceum shows in May 1980....wow. Phil is singing with gusto. He’s singing with this chip on his shoulder, almost like with a snarl-the band is grooving behind him with power; magnificent. The crowd is rowdy. I’m just blown away by those Duke concerts in London that spring. I wish they had a live version of them available I could get obtain. Couldn’t have been there though, as I was only a 7 month old baby at the time. All in all just incredible.

Here's where I do my usual thing of crowing about the fact I was at the 2nd Lyceum gig, the 7 May one filmed by the BBC. And very proud to have played my tiny role in this bit of Genesis gig history.

Selling England.

Tough to answer because I think there were peak moments at various points.

We could argue that they recorded and subsequently performed their most challenging and complex music on the SEBTP tour. From recordings I've heard, Peter also seems far more engaging, more spontaneous in his responses to the audience or things happening on stage.

Having said that, I also think they became a better oiled machine on later tours.

For example, I think Firth of Fifth and Supper’s Ready were executed more flawlessly in 77, compared to the 73/74 tour.

And, then with Phil as the frontman, I agree with others who suggest he just seemed to gain complete mastery of the audience by 1980. I think it also helped with Duke that they were still, for the most part, recording and also performing songs that appealed to all eras of Genesis fans.

It's quite an interesting topic and not an easy one to sort out, particularly trying to leave personal preferences aside. I don't think for instance that their peak live necessarily coincided with the albums and their songwriting. I loved the 3SL period for instance, I saw them live and they were bristling with an energy they didn't have before but without being sloppy. Phil's singing was stellar and he still hadn't abandoned his drum set. Still, I think Abacab was one of their weakest albums. Album-wise I think we can all agree that unlike other historic bands, Genesis don't have a definitive album. They had incredible streaks though. If we take SEBTP, The Lamb and Trick, three albums that constantly rank at the top in any poll, they are all quite different one from another. Trick for instance, my personal favorite is probably their most even album, the material is strong but there isn't any Cinema Show, Supper's Ready or The Musical Box on it. If I were to try and make the two areas converge and align, I would probably agree that the Duke period and subsequent tour would be' ''It''. Solid songwriting, excellent album, great performances, very energetic but still retaining the spirit and magic of yore. Phil still an unbelievable drummer but also a world class vocalist, probably for the first time. I saw those Lyceum gigs on YouTube and they are just wonderful, they close a decade and a chapter on a very high note.

For their live peak I'd have to say the Mama Tour. There's a confidence and an effortlessness from everyone on stage that makes that period stand out to me. There's a lot of energy coming off of those Duke and Abacab shows but it's a little wild and unfocused at times.

Songwriting is a little harder to judge. Looking back it seems like each era ramped up and once it hit a climax something changed and they went in another direction.

Quote from Backdrifter

Here's where I do my usual thing of crowing about the fact I was at the 2nd Lyceum gig, the 7 May one filmed by the BBC. And very proud to have played my tiny role in this bit of Genesis gig history.

That must have been incredible. What are your standout memories of the gig?

Probably the Lamb time, but before that too.

Their artistic peak to me was probably the Lamb, but this wasn't their live peak as far as I am concerned. I'd say their live peak was Duke tour to Mama tour. By that point they were on fire blazing through their material with such energy. They were all at their playing peak with a lot of confidence, and Phil was at his vocal peak. After the Mama tour things seem to drop off a bit to me in terms of live performance and energy.

For sheer power and excitement just listen to this band play through the Duke Suite from that famed Lyceum gig. Hard to beat that at any other point of their career.

Songwriting peak was probably Duke also. They were blending their earlier adventurous side with a more straightforward delivery and hadn't yet sunk into the repetitive song structures seen later.

Great question. I think they hit their artistic peak between 1972-77, but their playing peak was probably in the early to mid 80s.