TotW 06/19/2023 - 06/25/2023: GENESIS - Inside And Out

One of the best song during this era…

Interesting facts #273, #274 and #275:

Pigeons was originally intended to be the lead track on the EP, despite the swear word which would have denied it airplay (in the UK at least). The French were less prurient and released a two track single of Pigeons c/w I&O.

The Canadian black vinyl edition of the 12" EP is far more scarce than the "considered-rare" blue vinyl.

When the EP was reissued for the 2012 RSD, the original mixes were used, rather than the Davis remixes, the only re-release which hasn't used the latter since those first appeared.

Ten from me. It’s good, nicely written and performed. I know there has been discussion about whether or not it should have made the album. It’s certainly good enough and in the CD era would have been on there. But I like Wind and Wuthering as it is and without this track the EP would have been much poorer. Steve did a good live version of this on tour and it deserves some plaudits.

Possibly my favorite Genesis non-album track, which is fitting because the 4-man era is my favorite phase of the band.

This was the first Genesis non-album track I ever heard, or heard of, back in the pre-Internet days when discography information was harder to come by and one couldn't simply search for music online. I originally knew of it not as a track from "Spot the Pigeon" (which I only heard about later), but as the U.S. B-side of "Follow You Follow Me."

When I first heard this track I couldn't believe it had been relegated to what is essentially a B-side.

To this day, I still love the song, and the sheer Hackett-ness of it.

However, I don't see where or how it would fit on WAW, so I think they made the right choice.

Quote from Mozo

When I first heard this track I couldn't believe it had been relegated to what is essentially a B-side.

To this day, I still love the song, and the sheer Hackett-ness of it.

However, I don't see where or how it would fit on WAW, so I think they made the right choice.

To replace "Your Own Special Way" which is doesn't very good, especially the long version.

I appreciate YOSW isn't massively popular with fans. I mean, I like it, but that's almost irrelevant I think.

Whether IAO is a better song isn't the issue for me. I just don't think it fits on the album. For me the nature of the lyrics just don't fit the atmosphere of the album.

I like the song a lot, but I think it would stick out like a sore thumb.

All In A Mouse's Night would be a better choice to be replaced, that way the EP as a whole would be more comical.

I already posted my revamped tracklist for W&W elsewhere, but here it is again:

Side A:

Eleventh Earl Of Mar

One For The Vine

Wot Gorilla?

Blood On The Rooftops

Side B:

Your Own Special Way

Inside And Out

"Unquiet Slumbers For The Sleepers... In That Quiet Earth"

Afterglow

Quote

Credits: Banks/Hackett/Rutherford
Lyrics: Yes
Length: 7:44

Um, that should be "Bank/Collins/Hackett/Rutherford" and 6:43. The writing credit and length given above are for "Eleventh Earl of Mar."

I gave it a 12. The main song is good, with its gentle guitar arpeggios and sweet melody. I thought they should have transposed it to a different key so that the whole chorus doesn't have to be in a high falsetto, which weakens it a bit too much. Consider a song like Ripples, where the chorus just soars because it is still mainly in Phil's higher chest-voice range. I've always been a tad uncomfortable with the lyrics. For how I interpret them, a woman initiates a sexual encounter and then a man goes to jail, the implication being that she changes her story and blames him: "If what she says is so..."

My favourite part of the song is the ending instrumental, with a great keyboard solo by Tony and a skittering guitar solo from Steve. My problem with this section is that it sounds just stuck on, with no musical relationship with the main song (if there is a relationship, I can't find it). Obviously this happens with other great Genesis songs, e.g., The Cinema Show. However the transition here is particularly sudden and jarring, whereas the transition in other songs is more smooth.

So many great things about it for me and also some reservations.

Yep, that's the only weakness I see in this song. It should have gone back to the chorus after the instrumental section. Also, and I know I represent a minority with this, I am not too fond of the keyboard solo. It's mainly the sound of the synth that bothers me, it has some pitch effect that gets a little annoying during the fast runs. But maybe I'm nitpicky.

It's good but overrated. I do enjoy the Yes-style instrumental ending, although it doesn't really go anywhere. The chorus I've never found particularly strong but it works well enough. Like Dr. John I have trouble with the lyrics. What exactly is the story here? A girl maliciously accuses a boy of rape? It's an odd thing to write about when actual rape and violence against women is far, far more common.

12 from my side. A lovely track. Saw Nad Sylvan perform this with Steve Hackett. That was better than I expected!

The best track on the EP by miles, but at the same time it's obvious why it didn't make it onto Wind & Wuthering. It's just not strong enough as a song and the noodling keyboard solo at the end does nothing for me. It's a close but no cigar track.

Quote from raelway siding

It's good but overrated. I do enjoy the Yes-style instrumental ending, although it doesn't really go anywhere. The chorus I've never found particularly strong but it works well enough. Like Dr. John I have trouble with the lyrics. What exactly is the story here? A girl maliciously accuses a boy of rape? It's an odd thing to write about when actual rape and violence against women is far, far more common.

It does happen though, rare or not. We even had a case here in the UK recently where a girl smashed herself in the face with a hammer (There was CCTV of her buying it) to reinforce her case. As the song suggests, a jail term for an innocent man is no laughing matter!

This is in my personal Genesis top 10, I've always loved it right from when it came out and my brother bought it.

In relation to earlier comments:

While I realise omitting Collins from the credits was an honest error, it's relevant in that we gather from Hackett that Collins wrote the lyrics. On the subject of which, as per foxfeeder 's comment, I don't get the disquiet about the story. First, I don't think the accusation is of rape but of molestation/sexual assault, apparently unjustified according to the "...she said put your hand here" line. It doesn't negate the fact that actual male on-female-sexual assault is much more common, nor does it preclude writing a song about it.

Regarding the sudden change from part 1 to part 2 and the feeling that it's something of a shotgun marriage, it's probably mainly explained by the lyric sheet on the original EP back cover. Above the lyrics it says 'INSIDE', below them it says 'OUT'. ie, the upbeat instrumental represents his release.

The keyboard line is often referred to as a 'solo' which, while I get that, has never come across to me. It feels to me like an integral part of the overall sound picture, one of its intrinsic layers, as opposed to eg Cinema Show where it's much more obviously a solo to my ears, a very distinct lead line over a backing track.

I love the energy of the instrumental and Hackett's work in particular in that he sounds very unlike he does on any other Genesis song. I especially like the half-time lead-out, which brings an extra weightiness and the again very unusual discords over the horzontal backing track with its tumbling drums and the occasional volume swells on the glittering cascading keyboards. It's an overall sound picture that's somewhat odd for them, placing it in a different league from most of the stuff on W&W. I always liked when they sounded different from their usual selves.

I don't get the Yes comparison at all. Re Hackett's W&W 40th rendition, I found the first half very good, the second a crashing disappointment.

full score!

One of my all time favs. Never understood why that was not on the album.

Quote from Backdrifter

Regarding the sudden change from part 1 to part 2 and the feeling that it's something of a shotgun marriage, it's probably mainly explained by the lyric sheet on the original EP back cover. Above the lyrics it says 'INSIDE', below them it says 'OUT'. ie, the upbeat instrumental represents his release.

Ahh, I'm still learning new things from this board. My only version of the EP before the box sets was a mini-CD, where all the lyrics were so tiny that I didn't even both looking at them carefully. OK, so I get that the change in mood and feel was perhaps intentional. Thanks.